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Mrs. Caroline Desbiens (Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d'Orléans—Charlevoix, BQ)

Feb/7/23 5:05:13 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, we have just witnessed an amazing show put on by the party next to us. I worked a long time in the arts, so I could really appreciate the show put on by our colleague and his fellow members. However, a show is superficial. What I really want to know is how my colleague thinks he can control the damage caused by hurricanes and control the rise in illnesses caused by pollution, using nothing more than reductions obtained by abolishing the carbon tax. Will it be enough, given the total cost of climate change to society?

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Mr. Richard Bragdon

Feb/7/23 5:06:17 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I am pleased to respond to my colleague from Quebec's question. I will simply say this, and the answer is very clear. It is in technology and innovation. I believe Canadians have the best environmental practices for extraction of energy and utilization of energy, as well as for farm production and growing our food, of anywhere in the world and in comparable jurisdictions. We have a great news story, and the more we can replace dictator oil, and the more we can replace oil from regimes that do not have near the environmental regulations that Canada does, the bigger the favour we are doing for the world's environment.

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Ms. Lisa Marie Barron (Nanaimo—Ladysmith, NDP)

Feb/7/23 5:07:03 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, my hon. colleague and I agree on one thing, and that is that people are most definitely struggling right now. I can be on board with us identifying and moving forward with practical solutions, such as those the member was speaking of. I am wondering if the member could explain why, when only certain provinces would benefit from this motion, he would not support us removing GST from all home heating, so we could look at, as he says, cutting a break for those who are struggling most.

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Mr. Richard Bragdon

Feb/7/23 5:07:41 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, the removal of the tax would benefit all Canadians from coast to coast to coast because every Canadian is affected by the carbon tax. Every time they go to the grocery store, the sticker shock from what they are seeing on the grocery shelves is in part a result of the carbon tax, because everything that is trucked, shipped and hauled is affected by the carbon tax, in every province and every jurisdiction in this country. We need to take this measure and cut the tax so people can keep the heat on in their homes.

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Mr. Denis Trudel (Longueuil—Saint-Hubert, BQ)

Feb/7/23 5:08:25 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, if everyone agrees, I will share my time with the member for Perth—Wellington What we are hearing right now is rather frustrating and sad. It kind of makes a person want to bang their head against the wall or slit their wrists in despair. As I said earlier, there is a major worldwide crisis right now, the climate crisis. It is huge and it is important, and we talk about it every day. Not long ago, the entire world met in Egypt to try to find solutions. According to what the UN chief told the entire globe, we need to do something and quickly. The situation is urgent. We need to take action. The major countries need to take action and make changes to the system so that we can change course. People are going to die. They are going to be forced into poverty. There are going to be natural disasters, floods and hurricanes, and they will happen more and more often. The UN chief is not the only one saying that. That is what is being said by thousands and thousands of scientists who write detailed reports that we can read. These things are most definitely going to happen. We now know that, 50 years ago, scientists were already predicting what is happening today. We know because we are living it right now. Canada is a G7 country. The party that is in government says it has a plan. Every day, during oral question period, the Liberals stand up and declare that they are going to do this and that. They talk about targets they are going to meet and they say that this or that is going to happen. However, that is not working. The plan by my friends across the way has never worked. Earlier, I presented the numbers showing that nothing the Liberals have done is working. Canada is the worst per capita greenhouse gas emitter in the G20. Despite all the fine speeches, all the interventions, all the reports, all the scientists and studies in committee, Canada produces more greenhouse gas emissions per capita than any other G20 economy. Canada is the only G7 country whose emissions have increased since 2015. What happened in 2015? Coincidentally, the Liberals came to power in 2015. The Minister of Environment and Climate Change is Mr. Équiterre, Mr. Environment. He is a star of the environmental left who told himself that he would make his stand in a G7 country, take action and effect change from the inside. However, the situation is only getting worse. The Liberals constantly repeat that they are taking action, but they are not getting results. Today, my Conservative friends, who are not pleased with this action that is leading nowhere, have announced that they will do even less. They propose to get rid of it all, to do nothing and to never intervene. I have never gotten a clear answer to a question that I have asked my Conservative friends many times: What will they do? This is not the first time that they have introduced such a motion. It is groundhog day with the Conservatives, who constantly propose cancelling the carbon tax. They always talk about the plan to triple, triple, triple the carbon tax. We cannot take it anymore, they have to stop. Some hon. members: Oh, oh! Mr. Denis Trudel: Seriously, you keep repeating yourselves. This is not easy for us. It is hard on the brain. Hearing the same things over and over again will drive anyone a little crazy. We have been hearing members say “triple, triple, triple” for six months now. At some point, enough is enough. Some hon. members: Oh, oh! Mr. Denis Trudel: This is not theatrical production, and I cannot respond to members who call out to me. In theory, this is a speech—

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The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Carol Hughes)

Feb/7/23 5:13:29 p.m.
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The hon. member for Lac-Saint-Jean on a point of order.

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Mr. Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe

Feb/7/23 5:13:39 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I understand you were speaking with someone else, but there are members of the Conservative Party talking to my colleague while he is making his speech.

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The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Carol Hughes)

Feb/7/23 5:13:48 p.m.
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Yes, but the hon. member answered. I ask everyone in the House to respect the person who has the floor and not to argue during that time. Those who want to have discussions should leave.

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Mr. Denis Trudel

Feb/7/23 5:14:16 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, so, I was trying to engage in constructive dialogue with my Conservative friends. I was saying that, no matter how many opposition days we spend talking about getting rid of the carbon tax, we will never come up with anything resembling a solution. Earlier, the hon. member for Louis-Saint-Laurent, whom I like very much, was asked a question. What would the Conservatives do? What is their plan? We know they want to axe the carbon tax, but what would they do instead? This is a major emergency situation. We all know this country switches back and forth between two governing parties. We spend 10 or 15 years with the red party, then 10 or 15 years with the blue party. Sooner or later, the blue party will be back in power. In the meantime, the orange party plays a supporting role over there. That is how the Canadian system works. Sooner or later, the blue party will be back in power with no plan, no idea what to do about the greatest crisis of our time. As I said earlier, this is both sad and disheartening. It is enough to make anyone want to bash their head against a wall. No wonder people in Quebec want to leave this country. No wonder we have 32 seats here. The red party and the blue party would love to get their hands on our seats in Quebec, but they are not taking action. They are not taking meaningful action on issues that are important to Quebeckers. A large majority of Quebeckers agree with me. People come to my office, people from organizations like Mothers Step In and La Planète s'invite in Longueuil. I meet young people and mothers in my riding who are worried about the future of humanity. They come to see me. They say we have to do something. They ask me to take action, to tell Parliament that we must take action. That is what I am doing. They have mandated me to do so. I am here to tell the so-called decision-makers in the government and the official opposition that they must take action. Something must be done. It is truly appalling that they have no plan to deal with the biggest challenge of our time. The Bloc Québécois has solutions. We have asked the government what needs to be done. First, Canada needs to stop investing in fossil fuels. That is absolutely essential. My Conservative friends are always saying that we need to invest in fossil fuels. It is unbelievable that the Liberals outdo even the Conservatives when it comes to supporting oil companies. I am not joking. The Liberals are so useless that there are environmentalists out there who miss the Conservatives. We are talking about an annual investment of $8.5 billion in fossil fuels. How much social housing could be built for $8.5 billion? How much housing could be built to help people who need it? There is a major housing crisis in Quebec and in Canada. I do not know how many times I have talked about this in the House. The Liberals promised they would stop investing in fossil fuels in 2023. I remember asking them about that on December 11. I brought up their promise that investments would drop to zero in 2023, which was 20 days away at that point. It was time to start thinking about it. Now it is 2023, and I have heard nothing about stopping investments. This is one of the first measures that must be implemented. This money must be invested in renewable energy. We need to make a radical shift. Quebec is ready to do that. We have Hydro-Québec. When the company is not being spied on by China, it makes very good electric batteries. They are working on electric motors. We need to put our money there. What could we do if we put the $8.5 billion we send to ExxonMobil into other things? That company made $75 billion in profits last year. Those poor people. Seriously though, we must take this money and invest it in the energies of the future. That is what we need to do.

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Mr. Kevin Lamoureux (Parliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons, Lib.)

Feb/7/23 5:19:29 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, listening to the member from the Bloc, one would think that all we need to do is click our heels and the transition would be complete and there would be no more fossil fuels being used in Canada. The member needs to recognize that there is a transition period. There have been some investments. We work very closely, for example, with the NDP provincial government in British Columbia on the LNG. It is about the principle of putting a price on pollution, as governments around the world have recognized the true value of that. It appears that the Conservative Party today has made it very clear that it opposes that principle. I am wondering if the member could provide his thoughts in terms of the principle of the price on pollution and the benefits to society.

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Mr. Denis Trudel

Feb/7/23 5:20:19 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, the carbon tax is a very good measure. However, it needs to be increased far more drastically than it has been so far. I think the UN was recommending that the tax be set at $200 per tonne now. Based on what we are hearing, it will be about $170 per tonne in 2030. That is much too late. It is two minutes past midnight right now. It is no longer one minute to midnight. We must do something drastic. My colleague's intervention makes me think of what my Conservative colleagues have been saying all day. They want to have it both ways. We have passed that point. It is after midnight.

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Mr. Don Davies (Vancouver Kingsway, NDP)

Feb/7/23 5:20:58 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, at a time when the planet has to reduce its carbon emissions, oil companies are making record profits. Canadian oil and gas companies are forecasted to make a record-breaking $147 billion in 2022 alone. I want to read a short quote from UN Secretary-General António Guterres. He said the fossil fuel industry is “feasting on...subsidies and windfall profits while households' budgets shrink and our planet burns.” He said that we need to hold the industry and its enablers to account. He said, “I am calling on all developed economies to tax the windfall profits of fossil fuel companies.” New Democrats believe we should be doing that. I wonder if my hon. colleague agrees.

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Mr. Denis Trudel

Feb/7/23 5:21:42 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I completely agree. I mentioned it in my speech. As I am not an expert, I cannot say how much we should tax those companies. We can see their profits are indecent. Those industries are still making bloated profits from what is happening in the world at this time. We must take this money and invest it for our children. The future of the planet is at stake. There is money there. It is indecent. We must invest it for the future.

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Mr. Clifford Small (Coast of Bays—Central—Notre Dame, CPC)

Feb/7/23 5:22:12 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, my riding is one of the strongest mining regions in Atlantic Canada. I have a copper mine very close to where I grew up. Right now it is struggling to stay open because of the carbon tax. Every megawatt of wind energy that is generated needs 1,500 kilograms of copper to produce wind energy. I know my hon. colleague from la belle province represents, for sure, lots of mines in his area. Mines are being developed to produce minerals for the green economy. Does he think that those mining companies should be subjected to a carbon tax when they are in fact producing things to produce green energy?

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Mr. Denis Trudel

Feb/7/23 5:23:16 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, that is not really my area of expertise, but I do know that the Bloc Québécois proposed a transitional period for oil industry workers. What we are saying is that, one way or another, fossil fuel production will have to cease. However, we know the industry creates a lot of jobs, and we know that matters. These are moms and dads who work in an industry, who have jobs, kids, hobbies, a house and bills to pay, just like everyone else. We are concerned about this, and we are ready to sit down for some level-headed negotiations to figure out how to make this transition, which needs to happen now, as painless as possible for these people.

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The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Carol Hughes)

Feb/7/23 5:24:04 p.m.
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The hon. member for Perth—Wellington, unfortunately, has only two minutes before we end the proceedings. The hon. member for Perth—Wellington.

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Mr. John Nater (Perth—Wellington, CPC)

Feb/7/23 5:24:17 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I will make full use of the full 120 seconds that I am granted to contribute to this debate. The reason we are here today is because after eight years of the current Liberal government, Canadians are finding it harder and harder to make ends meet. Therefore, we are here today with a very simple motion. It is a motion that so many Canadians would appreciate; that is to axe the carbon tax. We believe in keeping the heat on by taking the tax off. This motion is about the people of this country who work hard each and every day to provide for their families. This motion is about the farmers and farm families who go out every day and produce the food that, quite literally, feeds our country and feeds the world. This motion is about the small business owner who goes to work every morning and works hard to provide the services and the goods that will make our country operate. That same small business owner goes home each night and sits around the family kitchen table, adds up the expenses and figures out how to make payroll for the next week and figures out how to make their small business survive. Often, these businesses have been in the family for decades and for generations, and now they are at risk of closing because their expenses keep going up because of the decisions made by the current Liberal government. This motion is clear: Let us take the carbon tax off; let us stop the inflationary effect that the carbon tax is having on Canadians and let us make sure the farmers, the families, the parents and small business owners are allowed to get ahead.

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The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Carol Hughes)

Feb/7/23 5:26:00 p.m.
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It being 5:26 p.m., it is my duty to interrupt the proceedings and put forthwith every question necessary to dispose of the business of supply. The question is on the motion. Shall I dispense? Some hon. members: No. [Chair read text of motion to House]

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The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Carol Hughes)

Feb/7/23 5:27:07 p.m.
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Therefore, if a member of a recognized party present in the House wishes that the motion be carried or carried on division or wishes to request a recorded division, I would invite them to rise and indicate it to the Chair.

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Mr. John Nater

Feb/7/23 5:27:07 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, we request a recorded division.

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