SoVote

Nov/2/23 1:35:22 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, this is what I would say to the hon. member. I live in downtown west Toronto. That is where my riding of Davenport is. My constituents want the federal government to keep moving as aggressively and urgently as possible to reduce our emissions to meet our targets. I think they understand that the transition costs money. I think that they are very pleased with our plan for a price on pollution and that anything else we can do to continue to provide support to Canadians as we transition to meet our 2030 and 2050 targets would be supported.

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Mr. Marcus Powlowski (Thunder Bay—Rainy River, Lib.)

Nov/2/23 1:36:34 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, the CPC motion is to drop the carbon tax not only on oil temporarily but also on all heating fuels temporarily. Believe it or not, I actually have friends in the Conservative Party, who I think like me through my sometimes philandering political ways. My friends in the Conservative Party may be surprised to hear I actually approve of the carbon tax, and I am in favour of the announced Maritime exemptions. The Leader of the Opposition took the rather unusual step of appearing on Thunder Bay TV a few days ago in order to tell the people of Thunder Bay that the members of Parliament for Thunder Bay are basically useless because we did not get the same kind of exemption for natural gas and propane as the people in the Maritimes got for oil. Now, people all across Canada get the exemption for oil. In response to what the Leader of the Opposition had to say to this motion, let me start off by saying, and I think this is really important, most people know that 80% of people actually get back as much as, or more than, they pay in carbon tax. In addition, people in rural areas get 10% on top of that. Now, because of this announcement, that will be going up to 20%, including in northern Ontario. That is certainly justified because people in rural areas are often dependent on fossil fuels. They have further to commute, and they cannot resort to using mass transit. I am in favour of all those things. Why is the present plan withholding carbon tax on only oil and not on other fuels? There are good reasons for that, and I am going to talk about four reasons. First, the cost of heating one's house with oil is more expensive than with other fuels, particularly in the Maritimes. I want to mention some figures from a recent CBC report on the subject. Home heating oil in P.E.I., with the carbon tax, costs $47.87 per gigajoule of heat energy. Propane in Ontario costs $39.33 with the carbon tax. Natural gas in Saskatchewan is $12.09. To reiterate, that is a total of $48 for oil and down to $43 if we do not include the carbon tax, which we are removing. Propane is around $39, and natural gas is around $12. The bottom line is that people who heat with oil have to pay a lot more to heat their homes than people who heat with other fuels. Second, there are other differences with oil. One is the fact that oil produces more greenhouse gases than other fuels. The best is natural gas, and the second best is propane. In terms of low-hanging fruit, the best bang for one's buck is to get people off oil and into a green transition. Third, because the carbon tax is based on tonnes of CO2 produced, and oil produces the most CO2, the amount of carbon tax paid on oil is higher than on the other fuels. Lastly, and this is an important one, when a lot of older homes were built, they had oil furnaces in them. As I grew up in Kaministiquia, outside of Thunder Bay, we had an oil furnace. In the years since the 1960s and 1970s, a lot of people have transitioned to cheaper forms of fuel. The people who have not are often the people who could not afford to transition, and that leaves us in the ironic situation that the people who are least able to afford the fuel will have to pay the most. Both my party and I are not unsympathetic to such people, and that is why we are dropping the carbon tax for a limited period of time for those people. In terms of a long-term solution for people on oil, certainly heat pumps are part of the solution. As oil is dirtier, getting those people to transition to green sources of heating is certainly something that is desirable from an environmental perspective. We already have a program that offers $10,000 for low- and middle-income families in order to buy heat pumps. In addition to that, and this is the one difference in what people in the Maritimes are getting that we are not getting in Ontario, they are also getting an additional $10,000, which is $5,000 from the province and $5,000 from the federal government, if they want to put in a heat pump. That is because those provinces agreed to do it. If Ontario wanted to do it, I am told we, too, in Ontario could. I think this is important: The Conservative Party is not just suggesting a temporary pause on the carbon tax on heating fuels. It wants to get rid of the carbon tax altogether. It wants to axe the tax. Frankly, I do not agree with that, and I find it a little difficult to believe. Why does it want to get rid of the carbon tax when, in fact, a lot of Conservative economists actually think the carbon tax is one of the most efficient ways, if not the most efficient way, to reduce greenhouse gas emissions? Furthermore, a lot of Conservative economists like it because it is a market-based intervention rather than a regulatory intervention. Some of the many, perhaps they are not Conservative, but they are not really left-leaning, institutions that approve of carbon tax and carbon pricing include the American Enterprise Institute, a centre-right American think tank. In 2009, in response to the question, “[What is] the better approach to climate change?” Its answer was, “A direct tax placed on emissions of greenhouse gases. The tax would create a market price for carbon emissions and lead to emissions reductions or new technologies that cut greenhouse gases.” Of note, in 2023, like some other Conservatives, it seems to have changed its position. Some other groups, again, not exactly left-leaning institutions, that support carbon tax are the World Bank in 2023, the Business Council of Canada in 2019 and the Ontario Chamber of Commerce in 2021. The Canadian Chamber of Commerce, in a 2018 endorsement, said, “Carbon pricing is probably the most effective mechanism of emissions reduction.” Subsequent to this, it emphasized that the carbon tax should be flexible and competitive. Certainly with this, we are seeing some flexibility. Even the Conservative Party, in the last election, ran on a platform that included a carbon tax. I know that members of the Conservative Party deeply believe in their convictions, but it appears that when the political winds blow another way, their convictions seem to blow away, too, and they have to come up with new convictions. Now, they actually oppose it. I am somewhat shocked by the Conservative opposition to the carbon tax, particularly given what would seem to be the almost daily climate-related calamities we hear about, both in Canada and around the world. For example, a heat dome in B.C. recently killed over 600 people, mostly elderly people. Wildfires burned down the town of Lytton, B.C. and forced the evacuation of people in Alberta, Northwest Territories and—

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The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Carol Hughes)

Nov/2/23 1:44:04 p.m.
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There are continuous comments and responses coming from someone who has not been recognized to speak at this time, because it is not time. I would ask that member to please hold his thoughts and comments. He could write them down, and then once it is appropriate for questions and comments, he can attempt to stand up and to be recognized. The hon. member for Thunder Bay—Rainy River has two and a half minutes left.

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Mr. Marcus Powlowski

Nov/2/23 1:44:30 p.m.
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We all remember, in the spring, when the smoke was so thick in Ottawa that we could not see more than a couple of blocks away. In other areas, flooding is a problem. Flooding has been a problem in B.C. West of my riding, we had record flooding at the Lake of the Woods and Rainy Lake areas last year. The list goes on. The polar ice caps are melting. Permafrost is melting. Island states in the South Pacific risk disappearing forever because of rising sea levels. What is the Conservative Party's reply to all this? It wants to get rid of one of the government's best and most effective tools for dealing with climate change. I do not know about the opposition, but I feel a sense of duty to future generations, to my kids. I have tons of kids. One of them is Miko. Miko is only three years old. Miko has done absolutely nothing to contribute to climate change, yet he and his generation are the ones who are going to be asked to pay the price of climate change, rather than our generation or the generation before, if we do things like axing the carbon tax. What do the Conservatives want to do? They seem to want to do basically whatever it is going to take in order to get them elected the next time around. The Conservatives, in their 2021 convention, did not even want to agree to a statement saying they believed climate change existed. I do not like the tax. Nobody likes taxes. However, the reality is most people get the tax back in terms of the rebate, and it does motivate people to change over to green sources of energy. Most Canadians do believe in climate change and want to do what is best for their kids and for future generations. I, like most Canadians, perhaps begrudgingly, believe the carbon tax is absolutely the right thing to do. Therefore, I disagree with this motion.

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Mr. Todd Doherty (Cariboo—Prince George, CPC)

Nov/2/23 1:46:46 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, there was a lot of stuff in my hon. colleague's intervention. There were a lot of falsehoods. I sit on the health committee with him, and I have a lot of respect for him as he is a family physician and offers a lot of great insight in our health committee. It is one thing for this colleague to stand up and read the talking points of the Liberal Party very well, but he is an educated man, and I expect him to do better, not just to read the talking points like a clapping seal. He knows that the carbon tax is wrong and that it punishes Canadians. It raises the cost of growing food. It raises the cost of shipping food and, ultimately, it is Canadians who pay the price. There is no greater evidence to that than when the Prime Minister walked back his carbon tax on Atlantic Canadians. Why are they punishing the rest of Canada for the Atlantic Canadian MPs' failures?

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Mr. Marcus Powlowski

Nov/2/23 1:48:00 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I agree with my friend in the opposition on a lot of things, but I do disagree on this point. In terms of talking points, I refuse to use the party's talking points. I write all my speeches myself. I do believe in the carbon tax. I believe that by not continuing this carbon tax, which has been shown to be one of the most effective ways of dealing with climate change, the Canadian people and the people of the world would be punished. The opposition would be punishing them. They would continue to suffer because of climate change and because they are being denied one of the most useful and efficient tools to deal with climate change. Yes, there is some short-term pain but for the long-term gain.

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Mr. Gord Johns (Courtenay—Alberni, NDP)

Nov/2/23 1:48:51 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, we also believe that there should be a price on carbon and that we need to take climate action seriously, to take real action and to move rapidly. The Liberals decided to do a carve-out that is only going to take pressure off Canadians in terms of home heating. We hear the Conservatives say they are bringing forward a motion to help all Canadians. In B.C., that motion the Conservatives are bringing forward will not help British Columbians. It will not take any taxes off their home heating. We put forward a motion to remove the GST on home heating for all Canadians. It was in the Conservative 2019 platform. They rejected our amendment to apply the GST removal to provinces that were not going to be impacted by their motion today. Does my colleague believe it was either a) because it was not their idea that they rejected it, or was it b) because they actually do not believe in taking action on climate change, and that is why they brought forward this motion today that does not really help all Canadians?

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Mr. Marcus Powlowski

Nov/2/23 1:49:53 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I am assuming that he is asking me to interpret the motivation of the Conservative Party in bringing forward this motion. I cannot really comment on their motivation. As to removing the carbon tax on the GST, I do not really have much comment on that. As for who is going to benefit from this, and why we removed the carbon tax on oil, we clearly did it because the people who pay the highest price for oil and who are the least able to afford it are people with oil furnaces. The NDP should appreciate that we are targeting people who are the most adversely affected while maintaining our position that the carbon tax is, again, one of the most effective ways of dealing with climate change and of reducing greenhouse gas emissions.

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Mr. Chad Collins (Hamilton East—Stoney Creek, Lib.)

Nov/2/23 1:50:46 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, we continue to see one party in the House spread misinformation. I heard a “falsehood” earlier, and that term is used in response to my colleague. Whether it is the member for Sarnia—Lambton talking about battery fires with EVs, the member for Niagara West talking about ivermectin being used to combat COVID-19 or the suggestion by the member for Saskatoon—University, who discouraged Canadians from using heat pumps because they would not get home insurance, this misinformation, I think, does a lot of damage to discussions in the House. I wonder if my colleague can speak to the whole issue of relying on science to adopt a climate policy.

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The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Carol Hughes)

Nov/2/23 1:51:34 p.m.
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There are still individuals who are trying to contribute to the discussion, and they are not the ones who have the floor, so I would ask those members to please hold off. The hon. member for Thunder Bay—Rainy River.

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Mr. Marcus Powlowski

Nov/2/23 1:51:47 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I thank my colleague for pointing out the very disturbing fact that so many people in society seem to be willing to question the scientific empirical method that basically has led, in many ways, to the advancement of society. I am not going to point the finger at anyone here, but the fact that so many people are willing to subscribe to conspiracy theories rather than follow science, which has, in so many ways, tremendously bettered the lives of many people in Canada, is certainly disturbing.

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The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Carol Hughes)

Nov/2/23 1:52:32 p.m.
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Before I recognize the member, I will advise him that I will have to interrupt him for question period. Resuming debate, the hon. member for Fundy Royal.

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Hon. Rob Moore (Fundy Royal, CPC)

Nov/2/23 1:52:44 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, it is an honour to speak today. I will be splitting my time with the member for Calgary Forest Lawn. The motion we are debating today is, “That, given that the government has announced a 'temporary, three-year pause' to the federal carbon tax on home heating oil, the House call on the government to extend that pause to all forms of home heating.” What could be more fair? This is a reasonable, common-sense and fair-minded motion that addresses the concerns that we are all hearing from our constituents as the cost of living continues to rise under the government. I will repeat the motion, which says, “That, given that the government has announced a 'temporary, three-year pause' to the federal carbon tax on home heating oil, the House call on the government to extend that pause to all forms of home heating.” The motion is simply asking for fairness for all Canadians, regardless of the region or the way they choose to heat their homes. All of us in this House and all Canadians, especially Atlantic Canadians, are acutely aware of what happened with the Prime Minister. He brought in a carbon tax that hurts working people, single mothers and families that are trying to make ends meet. It hurts people who get up early in the morning and drive to work in their vehicles. It hurts parents who take their kids to a hockey game. It hurts families that are trying to put food on the table. It hurts senior citizens on fixed incomes who are trying to heat their homes. All members have heard from their constituents about the damage that is being done by the carbon tax. The Conservative leader was about to hold an axe-the-tax rally in Atlantic Canada, in the province of Nova Scotia. I have been to rallies before where many people are very concerned about the carbon tax and are very enthusiastic about the Conservative Party's plan to axe the carbon tax, to make life more affordable, to give Canadians back a little more of the money that they work so hard to earn. The Prime Minister and his Atlantic members of Parliament have been steadfast in voting in favour of the carbon tax every single time. It is funny that when it was the constituents of Atlantic Liberal members who were suffering losses, those members did not stand up to the Prime Minister. Their constituents called them, and we know these calls are coming in. Their constituents said that they do not know how they will pay their heating bills or put gas in their cars, that they have to choose whether to buy groceries for their kids or heat their homes. We know that is happening. It is happening in Atlantic Canada. It is happening throughout Canada. The Liberal members of Parliament in Atlantic Canada and the Prime Minister, when the tables were turned, and the numbers were not looking so good, realized that their jobs were on the line. Forget their constituents, when those members saw this could cost them something, it got their attention. The very day the Conservative leader was in Nova Scotia for an axe-the-tax rally, the Liberals crassly announced this completely transparent proposal to freeze the carbon tax on home heating oil only. In my province of New Brunswick, 90% of homes are not heated with home heating oil. This does not apply to those people. We are hearing other Liberal members throughout the country asking about their constituents and what is going to happen to them in the next election. Every Atlantic Canadian knows that the Prime Minister and Liberal members have voted to make their lives tougher. Every one of us knows mortgage payments have gone up, that the cost of groceries has gone up, that the cost of fuel has gone up, that people are being taxed every step of the way. Conservatives can see right through this panicked reaction. If it were not so sad, it would be laughable. There is this increase the government has given to rural areas. Let us talk about rural New Brunswick. If someone is a tenured professor or a provincial bureaucrat living downtown in the city of Fredericton, the capital city of New Brunswick, they get the rural top-up. If someone lives in my riding in the village of St. Martins, with a population under 300, they could have a 100-kilometre round trip commute to work in Saint John. It is truly a rural community. Elgin, New Brunswick, has a population under 200. It is an over 100-kilometre commute to the city of Moncton for work. It is truly a rural community. They do not get the rural top-up. That is how twisted the Liberal proposal is and how little the Liberals understand the needs of New Brunswickers and the needs of rural Canadians. As he watches his support drop to new lows, the Prime Minister is now trying to rebrand himself, very transparently, as a hero for Atlantic Canadians living in rural communities. This is a frantic attempt to slow down the support for our axing the tax movement. The Prime Minister announced a slight increase to the rural rebate but is applying it to urban centres. People living with the high cost of fuel, the high cost of groceries and the high cost of heating their homes are getting no relief whatsoever. That is why it is heartening to see from coast to coast to coast different provinces standing up and saying that now is the time to axe the carbon tax, that now is the time to help people. Everyone recognizes this. Everyone recognizes it, except for the Prime Minister and his Liberal caucus. I know this drives Liberals crazy, but how often have we all seen the Prime Minister get into his motorcade and jet off to some other country to preach about his virtue—

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The Speaker

Nov/2/23 2:00:06 p.m.
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I hate to interrupt the hon. member for Fundy Royal in the middle of his speech, but it is now time for us to move to Statements by Members. The hon. member will have two minutes and 40 seconds left in his speech to continue at the next opportunity.

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Mr. Churence Rogers (Bonavista—Burin—Trinity, Lib.)

Nov/2/23 2:00:36 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, is you 'appy? We all know laughter is the best medicine and there is a group in my home province of Newfoundland and Labrador who have been making people laugh for decades. Buddy Wasisname and the Other Fellers have entertained people across this country for 40 years. Through skits, songs and an amazing storytelling ability, audiences have left their sold-out shows with the best belly laughs imaginable. Professionals before even performing in this group, Kevin Blackmore, Wayne Chaulk and Ray Johnson are gifted musicians, songwriters, authors, vocalists and true ambassadors for Newfoundland and Labrador's culture and heritage. With 20 albums, three television specials and, most recently, Music Newfoundland's Lifetime Achievement Award and also being named to the Order of Canada, we are all lucky and honoured to call them ours. Please join me in offering sincere congratulations to the members of this group on all their accomplishments.

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Mr. Matt Jeneroux (Edmonton Riverbend, CPC)

Nov/2/23 2:01:48 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, it is an honour to rise today in the House of Commons to recognize a tremendous accomplishment by an organization that is dear to my heart. Alberta-based APPLE Schools has once again been recognized as one of the top 100 global education innovations by HundrED, a Helsinki-based organization dedicated to identifying transformative and scalable education innovations worldwide. APPLE Schools was selected from over 3,000 innovations and subjected to a comprehensive evaluation. This achievement not only highlights the profound effect the organization is having on the lives of children in Alberta and across Canada, but it is also internationally recognized for its significant impact and scalability in the education landscape. This underscores the unwavering commitment of APPLE Schools to its vision of fostering healthy children in healthy schools. I congratulate the entire APPLE Schools team.

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Mr. Adam van Koeverden (Milton, Lib.)

Nov/2/23 2:02:46 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, Team Canada continues to crush it at the 2023 Pan American Games in Santiago, Chile. The official slogan of this year's games is “Dream, Play, Win”. That is exactly what Canadian athletes are doing. Team Canada has secured an impressive medal count, including 35 gold, 34 silver and 47 bronze medals as of today. Milton's Collyn Gagne won a silver medal in the swimming pool in the 400 IM. From the Canadian track-cycling team, Milton's own Michael Foley led the team pursuit, with Sean Richardson, Chris Ernst, Carson Mattern and Campbell Parrish to gold and a new Pan Am record. The women's team with Devaney Collier, Kiara Lylyk, Fiona Mejendie and Ruby West established their dominance with gold in the women's team pursuit. Nick Wammes also won a gold in the team sprint with James Hedgcock and Tyler Rorke, while Sarah Orban, Jackie Boyle and Emy Savard also crushed it with a bronze. Track cycling is really popular in Milton, because when we hosted the 2015 Pan Am games, Milton hosted the cycling, and our velodrome is a legacy of those games. The 2023 Pan Am Games closing ceremony is this weekend, on November 5, but the Para Pan Am Games will run from November 17 to 26. I congratulate all the athletes. Go, Canada, go!

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Mrs. Marilène Gill (Manicouagan, BQ)

Nov/2/23 2:03:55 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, it is with great appreciation that I rise today to mark the 20th anniversary of Action‑Chômage Côte‑Nord. I want to thank Line Sirois, the board of directors and all those who supported this organization over the past two decades. Their work is essential, not only because they help people in need on the north shore, but also because, through their actions and representations, they keep bursting the Ottawa bubble and reminding us why we were elected, and that is to speak on behalf of our constituents. Tourism, fisheries and forestry workers support families, businesses and communities and help to occupy more of this vast land where we want to live. These workers are entitled to respect and dignity. Action‑Chômage Côte‑Nord gives them that. They have the right to be able to put food on the table all year round. They have the right to comprehensive EI reform. Together, we will give them that, and not 20 years from now. I wish Action‑Chômage Côte‑Nord a happy anniversary.

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Ms. Julie Dzerowicz (Davenport, Lib.)

Nov/2/23 2:05:02 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, Canada has always been a country that has needed immigrants to grow our economy. They enrich our country from coast to coast to coast. Our diversity has become our strength, with Canada continuing to be ranked as one of the top countries in the world to live. I am proud to let this House know that as of this week we have formally welcomed 40,000 Afghans to Canada, a promise we made and have now fulfilled. This is a huge achievement, as the rights and freedoms of the Afghan people, especially women and girls, have sadly gone backwards. We have also made changes to our international student program to ensure that talented students who choose to study in Canada have a positive experience and that we close loopholes that have led to international students being exploited by bad actors. I am pleased that yesterday we announced our immigration levels that reaffirmed that Canada continues to be open to newcomers, who enrich our country with their hard work and talent. Diversity is indeed Canada's strength, and we are a better and stronger country because of the extraordinary people who choose Canada as their home.

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Mr. Pat Kelly (Calgary Rocky Ridge, CPC)

Nov/2/23 2:06:16 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, a desperate, flailing Prime Minister admitted that his carbon tax was punishing Canadians and making life unaffordable when he decided to remove the carbon tax from some but not all Canadians. This weekend, the minister from Long Range Mountains, Newfoundland and Labrador, admitted that this exemption was not granted to all Canadians across the country because they do not all vote Liberal, pitting Canadians from one region against those from another. What about the Liberal minister from Edmonton Centre? What about the member for Calgary Skyview? Are these two Liberal MPs from Alberta so incompetent and so ineffective that they could not get an exemption for Alberta? Do they agree with the minister that Alberta should pay a higher carbon tax than Atlantic Canadians? After eight years, the Prime Minister is not worth the cost. Even Rachel Notley thinks Alberta deserves this exemption. However, there is still a chance. On Monday, the NDP-Liberal government can vote for our plan to pause the tax on heating until Canadians have a chance to vote for a common-sense Conservative government that will axe the tax for good for all Canadians.

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