44th Parl. 1st Sess.
November 28, 2023 10:00AM
- Nov/28/23 10:27:01 a.m.
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Madam Speaker, the senator's contact information is widely available on websites. The member is simply trying to distract.
I want to tell the member what intimidation looks like. Intimidation is when a single mother opens the fridge in the morning and there is nothing there. She looks over at the empty lunch bag that she needs to fill for her children and there is nothing to put in it. Intimidation is when, at the end of the month, she looks at the bills that have stacked up, then at her bank account and the former is way bigger than the latter. She does not know where she is going to live the next month. That is the real intimidation that the government has imposed on working-class people right across this country.
If he wants to talk about threats, it is the threat to the quality of life of the people who do the work in this country that I am most worried about.
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- Nov/28/23 10:27:55 a.m.
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Madam Speaker, what we are seeing again today is not only intimidation, as my colleague pointed out, but also disinformation. I have heard the leader of the official opposition tell the House that people wanted medical assistance in dying because they had nothing to eat. The leader of the official opposition has also said that the ballot issue in the next election will be the carbon tax even though he is well aware that tax does not apply in Quebec.
I have one very simple question for the leader of the official opposition. Does he even believe himself when he says things like that?
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- Nov/28/23 10:28:32 a.m.
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Yes, Madam Speaker, I do believe those things, and I know it.
For starters, I am not the one who said that people are asking for medical assistance in dying because they are going hungry. That was the CEO of Food Banks Mississauga. My colleague can read her comments about how people went to the food bank to request medical assistance in dying. They did so not because they were sick, but because they were hungry. The Bloc Québécois members do not know this because they spend all their time travelling around Europe to talk about sovereignist movements over there. They could not care less about the people in their own ridings.
Furthermore, the carbon tax does apply in Quebec. Food produced elsewhere in Canada is taxed when truck drivers transport it to Quebec, and there is another 17¢-per-litre carbon tax coming that will apply and that the Bloc Québécois wants to drastically increase.
Only the Conservative Party wants to eliminate those taxes and bring prices down for Quebeckers.
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- Nov/28/23 10:29:41 a.m.
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Madam Speaker, I am astounded at the sheer audacity of the Conservatives lecturing us on the Senate. After all, this is a party that has a history of appointing party bagmen and failed candidates. This is the party of Nigel Wright and Mike Duffy. This is the party that has 15 senators who still caucus with it every week, the only party, and this is a party that has their senators frequently block private members' bills in the past.
Is the member for Carleton aware of his own hypocrisy and why does he think he can stand here and lecture us on the Senate?
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- Nov/28/23 10:30:18 a.m.
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Madam Speaker, I will tell the member why I think I can lecture him. It is because the member betrayed his constituents. They elected him to be a member of the opposition and, instead, he works for the Prime Minister. Every time I go to Vancouver Island, people say their MP sold them out, sold them down the river. He voted to ban their hunting rifles while allowing violent gun criminals onto the street. He voted to hand out dangerous drugs that caused crime and chaos in tent cities all over Vancouver Island. He voted to quadruple the carbon tax in order to fund the extravagances of the Prime Minister.
New Democrats, especially those from Vancouver Island, are working for the Prime Minister instead of working for the common people in their constituencies. It is not only me who should lecture the member. It is every single Canadian who should lecture New Democrats that their job is to work for the people, not for the Prime Minister.
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Madam Speaker, every single Canadian wants one thing in life, or one thing among several in life, which is to have nutritious, sustainable and affordable food produced right here in Canada. However, the Prime Minister's carbon tax coalition with the NDP is making that almost impossible for Canadian farmers and for Canadian consumers.
The Parliamentary Budget Officer was very clear that Bill C-234, which we are trying to pass through the Senate, would save Canadian farmers close to $1 billion by 2030. These are not insignificant costs we are talking about that Canadian farmers are trying to absorb. We are seeing farmers struggle with higher input costs, higher interest rates and the paying of the carbon tax again and again.
This is reality, but there are consequences to this reality, which seem to be lost on the Liberal government. There are 800,000 Ontarians who made close to six million visits to the food bank last year, which is an increase of almost 40%. This is the highest single-year increase ever recorded. They cannot afford to feed their families.
The Liberals will say, every single question period, that all the Conservatives are going to do is cut. The cutting that is happening right now is Canadian families cutting meals for their kids and Canadian families cutting the heat down at night and putting on a sweater or a blanket because they cannot afford to heat their homes. These are the cuts happening every single day by Canadians, who are having to face extremely difficult choice of either feeding their family or heating their home. These are not choices that should have to be made in a country like Canada, but that is exactly what an ideological activist agenda by the Liberal-NDP government is forcing Canadians to do.
We have a common-sense Conservative bill, Bill C-234, that would help reduce costs for farmers and make food more affordable for Canadians, but the Liberal government is going out of its way to bully senators to block Bill C-234. This is disrespectful to this House of Commons, which is elected by the people to represent our constituents. This House, by a very strong majority, and in fact by every single opposition party in this House, supported Bill C-234. This is because every opposition party in this House understands the importance of Canadian agriculture. Every member of the official opposition understands the importance of ensuring Canadians have affordable food to put on their table, produced right here in Canada by Canadian farmers, ranchers and producers.
What we are seeing is the Liberals play games with the Senate, disrespecting, as I said, the decisions made by this House of Commons. My colleague from Wellington—Halton Hills has talked a great deal about the fact that this is a taxation bill that was passed by this House. The Senate does not have the jurisdiction or the authority to override a taxation bill decided upon by the House of Commons, and yet that is exactly what is happening. The Senate is playing games with the livelihoods of Canadian farmers. It is playing games with the lives of Canadian families who are struggling to put food on the table. Food should not be a luxury and it should certainly not be a plaything in the political gamesmanship of the Liberal government.
I want to take a moment to talk about the real-life consequences this is having on Canadian farmers. I had a phone call from a dairy farmer two weeks ago who was basically in tears. She has come to the conclusion that she is going to lose her farm by Christmas to bankruptcy. She has a number of loans on her farm, as every single farmer does. They have lots of assets but a lot of debt. Her interest rate on her debt went from 1.9% to 7.2%. She can no longer afford the interest payments. On top of that, her carbon tax and fuel bills have doubled over the last year, making it impossible for her to maintain her operation. This is yet another lost farm for Canadian farmers. It is lost jobs, but also lost production and lost yields.
A mushroom farmer from Ontario sent me a note. His carbon tax went up last year and he was going to be paying $173,000 in carbon taxes alone. When it goes up in 2030, his carbon tax bill will be $450,000 a year. How is that economically sustainable? I will tell us. It is not.
The government talks about environmental sustainability all the time, but it never talks about economic viability, which is the most important element. One cannot be environmentally sustainable if one no longer exists.
The note said, “It is difficult to see how our farm or any farm will remain in business if this continues. It will be unsustainable for our next generation to take on our farms, killing the food chain within Canada. This is not fair to farmers, families or the farming generations to come. It is not fair to Canadian consumers who want to eat food grown in Canada, which has a lower carbon footprint.”
Another letter from a poultry farmer in Alberta states that, last year, he paid $120,000 in carbon taxes. This year, he is paying $180,000. By 2030, his carbon tax bills will be $480,000 a year. He said, “We are a chicken business and just simply can't afford the crippling carbon tax. If this is allowed to continue and go to $170 a tonne, we will need to shut down. The tax we pay is not going to do anything to eliminate carbon emissions. Our best hope is that we increase our selling price to the consumer to recover these costs, which is the last thing you or I want to see in these inflationary times.”
We are seeing record-high food inflation in Canada as a result of farmers paying the carbon tax again and again. Not only do they pay it when they are heating and cooling their barns or drying their grain, but they are also paying it when they buy fertilizer, seed and chemicals. They are paying it again when they transport their grain or their cattle and when the rail line sends them their bill for moving their grain to port.
There are very few other industries that I can think of that pay the carbon tax more then Canadian farmers, yet they are dedicated to the job that they do and always finding better ways and new innovations to reduce their emissions. However, that is not taken into consideration whatsoever with bills that are being blocked by the Liberals.
A veteran retired from the military and moved to Saskatchewan. He said that, in 2020, his fuel bill was $7,000. In 2021, it was $9,000. In 2022, it is now $12,000. He said, “The weird part is that I drive my machinery the same amount and the same number of hours each year.”
His land is the same size, which means taxes are making up the difference in costs. “I am only farming a half-section, and I am farming organically. If I didn't, I would be broke by now.”
These are stories that we are getting in our office every single day. These are the real-life consequences of the carbon tax and the impact it is having on farmers. This is then increasing the cost of food, and Canadians are having to deal with that every single day.
When one increases the cost and carbon tax on the farmers who are growing the food, the truckers who are moving the food, the processors who are manufacturing the food and the retailers who are selling the food, do we know what happens? Food becomes unaffordable for the Canadian consumer. That is why we are seeing one in five Canadians skipping meals and record-breaking numbers at food banks.
This is not lost across Canada. We have letters from five premiers who are asking the Senate to pass this bill. Premiers across Canada understand the importance of this legislation. Saskatchewan, Alberta, Ontario, Nova Scotia and New Brunswick are begging the Senate to do its job, respect the will of the House of Commons and pass this legislation.
However, we have the Prime Minister's environment minister threatening to resign if this bill is passed. He says there will be no more carbon tax carve-outs. This comes days after the Prime Minister already admitted that his carbon tax is unaffordable and had a carve-out for home heating oil.
This is clearly common-sense legislation. It will make food more affordable. The most important thing is that Canadians want nutritious, sustainable, affordable food produced by Canadian farmers. Bill C-234 will make that a reality.
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- Nov/28/23 10:41:25 a.m.
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Madam Speaker, the Conservatives say they are begging senators. That is not what they are doing. They are actually inciting violence toward senators.
I have a news report with me, titled “Canadian Senator Flees Home Amid Safety Concerns Following ‘Wanted Poster’ Incident”.
Some hon. members: Oh, oh!
Mr. Mark Gerretsen: Can they at least stop heckling me while I talk about something so incredibly serious, Madam Speaker? It is outrageous.
Some hon. members: Oh, oh!
Mr. Mark Gerretsen: Now they are laughing, Madam Speaker.
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- Nov/28/23 10:42:01 a.m.
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Madam Speaker, I rise on a point of order. The member for Kingston and the Islands is—
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- Nov/28/23 10:42:03 a.m.
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The hon. member is not in his seat, so he cannot raise a point of order.
The hon. member for Chatham-Kent—Leamington.
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- Nov/28/23 10:42:14 a.m.
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Madam Speaker, I was not heckling the member across the way, so I do not know what he is talking about.
Can he please explain?
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- Nov/28/23 10:42:16 a.m.
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The hon. member is not the one he is accusing of heckling.
The hon. deputy House leader.
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- Nov/28/23 10:42:19 a.m.
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Madam Speaker, here is what the article says:
In a disturbing turn of events, Canadian Senator Bernadette Clement was reportedly forced to leave her home due to fears for her safety. The incident came about after a provocative post, akin to a ‘wanted poster,’ was shared online by former Conservative Party leader [the member for Regina—Qu'Appelle]. The post included Senator Clement’s picture and office phone number, triggering a deluge of abusive calls, including racist comments, and even a threatening phone call from an unidentified man.
Does the member agree that this was a good tactic by the Conservative Party of Canada?
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Madam Speaker, I find it interesting that the member for Kingston and the Islands, of all people, is bringing this up. Members should take a look at his Twitter feed. It is the epitome of hypocrisy that the member is raising this.
Of course, I do not agree with any member of the House or of the Senate being threatened. However, the Senate is receiving tens of thousands of phone calls and emails, through its information that is publicly available, from farmers and Canadians across this country asking senators to do the right thing and pass Bill C-234.
What is happening in the Senate is that it is trying to bring in amendments that have been turned down in the House of Commons and at the committee. There is no alternative for Canadian farmers to power grain dryers and their barns.
I agree that no one should be threatened or intimidated, but the Senate is being held accountable for the decisions it has made.
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- Nov/28/23 10:43:54 a.m.
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Madam Speaker, it is amazing to hear the hypocrisy of Conservatives talking about the Senate and democracy. They pick bums such as Larry Smith, who could not get elected, came in third, but got appointed to the Senate twice, as well as Leo Housakos, party bagman, who gets paid for life.
What is even more astounding is that this party had the gall to stand in this House and vote against a trade deal with Ukraine. Meanwhile, we see Tucker Carlson's pro-Putin propaganda, Republican pro-Putin propaganda, the Danube Institute and Stephen Harper pro-Putin propaganda. The Conservatives claimed it was on carbon pricing, which Ukraine has had for years.
The fact that the Conservatives would use carbon pricing to undermine Ukraine's war effort to support their right-wing hack friends in the United States is the height of hypocrisy for the Conservative Party.
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- Nov/28/23 10:44:48 a.m.
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Madam Speaker, I am not sure if there was a question there other than a diatribe. The epitome of hypocrisy from the NDP member is that they are propping up—
An hon. member: Oh, oh!
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- Nov/28/23 10:45:03 a.m.
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I ask the hon. member for Timmins—James Bay to allow the member for Foothills to address the comment, as this is a period of questions and comments.
The hon. member for Foothills.
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- Nov/28/23 10:45:12 a.m.
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Madam Speaker, the member of the NDP-Liberal government, unfortunately, never made it into cabinet with this agreement. I find it shocking in itself when someone sells their soul and does not really get anything for it. The member supports a government that sold a turbine to Putin to help him move his gas and helped fund Putin's war machine. That is the epitome of hypocrisy.
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- Nov/28/23 10:45:42 a.m.
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Madam Speaker, I think we are going to hear the two words “disinformation” and “bullying” over and over again today. We are going to hear those words a lot today.
What happened to the two senators in recent days is exactly what the Conservative Party tried to pull with the member for Richmond—Arthabaska: to tell people to call his office and voice their discontent. They are trying to fire up the worst in people for political reasons.
Does my colleague agree with me on that?
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- Nov/28/23 10:46:20 a.m.
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Madam Speaker, no, I do not agree. We have encouraged Canadian farmers, who have done so by themselves. For example, the Agriculture Carbon Alliance, a group that represents hundreds of different agriculture stakeholders and commodity groups across the country, has encouraged its members to phone and call senators.
When senators assume or accept that invitation to join the Senate, they accept the fact they are public figures. I know senators are upset by the fact that they are being held accountable for their votes. However, it is the democratic right of Canadians to hold elected officials and senators, who are not elected, accountable for the decisions they have made. That is exactly what is happening.
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- Nov/28/23 10:47:11 a.m.
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Madam Speaker, it is a pleasure to rise today to address an issue Conservatives have brought forward. They often like to use the term “common sense”. I would suggest that the common-sense approach the Conservative Party takes today is nonsense. In fact, today's motion highlights the degree to which it is out of touch with reality and what Canadians believe.
I do not believe for a moment that Conservatives understand the depth to which they are prepared to go to get “Axe the carbon tax” on a bumper sticker, which I believe will become the bumper sticker for the Conservative Party. They are prepared to sacrifice principles and, ultimately, attack parliamentarians, not only directly but, I would suggest, also indirectly.
It is amazing that Conservatives here are talking about this important piece of legislation and blaming senators because the Senate is not passing it based on the Conservative Party of Canada's political agenda. Members might recall the bail reform bill, which was not that long ago, in September. I spoke to the bill. There were a few people who spoke to it. In essence, the bill ensured there would be a reverse onus for repeat violent offenders when it comes to bail requirements.
The provinces, other stakeholders, law enforcement agencies and our whole judicial system were appealing to the government and the opposition parties to see that legislation come before the House and, ultimately, pass. That is what we were hoping to see. Back in September, we were pleased, as a government, when the Conservative Party suggested that we pass it with a UC motion. Here in the chamber, the Conservatives felt it was worthy enough to pass unanimously through the different steps, so we could get it to the Senate. Interestingly enough, today, the bill still has not passed at the Senate. Why is that? Arguably, it is because Conservative senators are playing games with the legislation. Where is the concern from the official opposition today with respect to that piece of legislation?
Conservatives sure liked to talk about it back in September. They wanted to make sure people had the impression that they wanted to see it pass. They do not today, because now they are playing games with it at the Senate. It seems to me that, when there are accusations coming from across the way about the behaviour of the Senate, they are very selective. Today, they are highlighting the price on pollution. They are offended because of it. Do members know how risky they are prepared to be on that issue? For them, everything is based on the price on pollution.
We now have a bill at committee called the Canada-Ukraine trade agreement. When that bill first came to the legislature, much like the bail reform bill, I honestly thought it would pass with unanimous consent. It is incredibly difficult to understand and believe that the only party in the chamber that voted against the Ukraine trade agreement is the Conservative Party of Canada.
An hon. member: Oh, oh!
Mr. Kevin Lamoureux: If Conservatives do not understand its relevance, Madam Speaker, that is beyond me. It speaks to why they are so upset today at the Senate: the price on pollution.
Why, at least in part, did they vote against the Canada-Ukraine deal? Publicly, what they say is that it was because of the price on pollution, even though there is a price on pollution today in Ukraine and even though when it comes to trade agreements, the European Union has made it very clear that a price on carbon, a price on pollution, is important and is part of the process. That is the lame excuse the Conservative Party is using. Time and time again, Conservatives want to talk about the price on pollution. Their sole focus is to try to make that the election issue, and that is why I say it is so risky. Conservatives were prepared to sabotage the Canada-Ukraine trade agreement because of the price on pollution. I suspect it probably has a little more to do with the far right element that we see day in and day out within the Conservative Party, and how the leadership office is run virtually by the far right today.
It is disappointing, because the Conservative Party of Canada is more concerned about the election in the next two years than it is about good, solid, sound policy. That is not in the best interests of Canadians. It might be in the best interests of the Conservative Party of Canada today under its new leadership, but it is not in the best interests of good, sound public policy. That is where the Conservative Party is found wanting. It was able to look at legislation and make a determination with respect to the bail reform bill, and I believe that was a good decision by the Conservative Party at that time. When Conservatives saw there was a great deal of effort that went into the bill from stakeholders and provinces saying this was legislation they wanted to see passed, ultimately, it passed with unanimous consent. Then it hit the floor of the Senate. We do not hear Conservative members of Parliament today asking where that particular piece of legislation is. They should put that on their caucus agenda and ask their caucus colleagues in the Senate, and there are about 14 or 15 of them, why they are not supporting that piece of legislation.
I am an optimist. I think the Conservatives could be shamed into ultimately supporting the Canada-Ukraine trade agreement. Let us see what happens at third reading. Even if somehow the Conservative caucus could collectively out-manoeuvre the leader of the Conservative Party today and get the bill through the House with some of them supporting it, we still have to get it through the Conservatives in the Senate. Are we going to see the Conservative wing in the Senate do what it can to prevent the Canada-Ukraine trade agreement? I remember standing in my place and talking about the trade agreement, saying it would be wonderful to see the legislation pass through the entire system before Christmas. What a wonderful, powerful statement that would make in support of Ukraine. More and more, it is looking like that will not be the case. Why is that? It is because of the fixation the Conservative Party of Canada has on the price on pollution.
The member who spoke before me talked about how the Liberals are bullying the Senate. That is an unbelievable comment. First of all, we need to recognize that we have a Prime Minister who has kept his word in terms of ensuring that the Senate is, in fact, independent. We saw this with the Senate appointments that have been made. At the end of the day, the only political, partisan senators are the ones who sit in the official opposition caucus meetings every Wednesday, the Conservative Party of Canada senators. They are the only ones who are aligned with a political party, but the party accuses the government of bullying the Senate.
My colleague put forward a question. Let us imagine, if we will, the former leader of the Conservative Party's developing and posting a wanted poster highlighting a senator's phone number and intimidating independent senators to take action. I got a copy of the one news article, and I would not mind making reference to some of the things that were said:
In a disturbing turn of events, Canadian Senator Bernadette Clement was reportedly forced to leave her home due to fears for her safety. The incident came about after a provocative post, akin to a ‘wanted poster,’ was shared online by former Conservative Party leader, [the member for Regina—Qu'Appelle]. The post included Senator Clement’s picture and office phone number, triggering a deluge of abusive calls, including racist comments, and even a threatening phone call from an unidentified man.
Following the threatening phone call, Senator Clement instructed her office staff to cease answering the phone. In a clear reflection of the heightened sense of fear, she decided to relocate from her Cornwall home to Ottawa, where her location could be safeguarded. The incident underscores the potential risks public figures face amidst escalating political tensions.
Senator Raymonde Saint Germain, a fellow member of the Senate, addressed this incident by raising a point of privilege with the Senate speaker. She called out attempts at intimidation and allegations of bullying, stating that one Conservative senator had labelled the independent senators as fascists. Furthermore, Senator Clement detailed a confrontation with Don Plett, the Conservative leader in the [Upper] House, who allegedly berated her and two other senators in a threatening manner.
Do the Conservatives really have the audacity to say that we as a government are bullying or intimidating senators, when they have the opposition House leader doing what he did, and a Conservative senator doing what he did to his senator colleagues? Can members imagine if something of that nature took place here on the floor of the House of Commons, if a member of the House of Commons made those sorts of threats? I do not know what allegations have been made, but I would be taking them very seriously. I would suggest that it might be a borderline privilege issue, and I would probably suggest that the Standing Committee on Procedure and House Affairs take a look at it. It comes from the leadership of the Conservative Party today, and that is why I say it is so risky.
When we asked earlier the leader of the Conservative Party what he thinks about the actions of the former leader, his House leader, what did he say? He said that senators' phone numbers are already publicized. In essence, he does not have a problem with the behaviour of the opposition House leader. When we posed the question to the previous speaker, he seemed a bit more rational on the issue, implying that he would not support any sort of violence. However, that was the member who accused the government of using inappropriate tactics to intimidate, when the situation is the absolute opposite.
It all comes down to the issue of the price on pollution and the degree to which the Conservative Party is prepared to push that issue. We have seen that. As has been pointed out on numerous occasions, the Conservative Party, in the last federal election, was against what is being proposed in the Senate today. According to an election platform document, in order to be a Conservative candidate, one had to support the party's election platform, and the election platform clearly indicated there would in fact be a price on pollution. Every member of the Conservative Party was involved in the issue, and it is only since we had the new leader put in place that we saw a change of heart, or a change of mind, and the mind was concerned about the next election as opposed to public policy, which I talked about previously.
The consequence of that change has been very profound. As a result, we now see a Conservative Party that jumps at every opportunity to highlight the price on pollution at all costs in order to condemn the government and the other opposition parties, because it stands alone on this issue. It jumps at every opportunity to try to discredit the issue of climate change, a price on pollution and measures that are progressive in nature and are there to support Canadians. I do not say this lightly, because when we talk about the price on pollution, there is no doubt that if the Conservatives get into government, they will get rid of it. However, what they do not tell us is that in a riding like Winnipeg North, more than 80% of the constituents actually get more money back than they pay on the price of pollution. The member stood in his place and talked about the issue of affordability, but the price on pollution in Winnipeg North ensures that there is more money going into the pockets of residents than there is in contributing towards the price on pollution. There is a net benefit, and Winnipeg North is not alone.
However, Conservatives, in taking that risk and that extreme position, are today emphasizing farmers. As a government, we have been very supportive of our farmers, and maybe in a question or two, I might be able to expand on ways in which we have been supportive of our farmers. The Conservatives are so fixated on the issue of a price on pollution that every one of them who voted actually voted against the Canada-Ukraine free trade agreement, contrary to what Canadians as a whole, let alone people of Canadian-Ukrainian heritage, feel on the issue, how the ambassador of Ukraine to Canada feels on the issue or how the Ukrainian Canadian Congress feels on the issue, not to mention the widespread benefits. They voted against the agreement because of their fixation on the issue, which is all based on the far right, extreme element that is alive and well in the leader of the Conservative Party's office. Like lemmings, they all follow the leader with respect to votes, which is why we saw opposition members ultimately vote against the Canada-Ukraine agreement. It was because of something Ukraine already has in place, a price on pollution. The Government of Canada and all the other parties except the Conservatives see the merit of that particular issue.
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