44th Parl. 1st Sess.
December 11, 2023 11:00AM
- Dec/11/23 7:49:40 p.m.
- Watch
Madam Chair, one thing of note is how the department has doubled in size in the last 10 years, from about 4,000 to almost 8,000, and the budget has increased significantly as well. The Liberals seem to always judge success by how much money they are spending on things. We see that the budget has gone up and the number of employees for the department has gone up, yet the Auditor General pointed out that they have not made any progress on this. Would the member agree with me that we are obviously not getting good value for money here?
102 words
- Hear!
- Rabble!
- add
- star_border
- share
- Dec/11/23 9:20:24 p.m.
- Watch
Madam Chair, I listened with great interest to the speech by the hon. minister. I am trying to understand something. I have seen Auditor General reports over the years since my time here in 2015, and it was a horrendous situation. In fact, the late Auditor General, Michael Ferguson, made it his special mission to bring attention to this situation.
How did we get to that place in 2015 when it was just a horrific state of affairs? What was the major change, in his opinion, that brought us at least to a better place? We are not in a perfect place, but at least we are in a better place.
111 words
- Hear!
- Rabble!
- add
- star_border
- share
- Dec/11/23 9:24:31 p.m.
- Watch
Madam Chair, I will be sharing my time with my colleague from Elgin—Middlesex—London.
I want to spend my time in tonight's debate talking especially about the Auditor General's report “Emergency Management in First Nations Communities”, which came out last year. I have been involved in public accounts off and on for the eight years I have been in this place, and I have seen some eye-wateringly incompetent services or performances by the government. It is almost as if the various ministers are in competition to see who can be the most inept.
There have been several contenders for the award. The Auditor General did a housing study in which it was discovered that the government did not even know whom it was housing, how many people it was housing or how many housing units were getting built, despite billions of dollars being spent, with Infrastructure Canada blaming CMHC for the failures, and vice versa, literally. However, not to worry; executives at Infrastructure Canada and CMHC all still got full bonuses despite the failure. Veterans Affairs was spending money on new programs to alleviate the wait-lists, with no ability to track whether the backlogs had improved or not. Here is a spoiler alert: They had not improved, and had actually gotten worse every year since 2015. However, not to worry; executives all received performance bonuses. The CRA ignored the Auditor General's warnings about over $27 billion of ineligible funding going out to corporations that should not have received the money. One would think that, with so many incompetent departments, perhaps the CRA or another organization would come out as the winner. However, not to worry; along came Indigenous Services and said it would take the gold medal.
The report is specifically about the emergency management of first nations communities, probably the very worst Auditor General's report I have read, period. The department happily spent three and a half times more on responding to crises than on preventive measures. It spent about $646 million responding to emergencies, but only $182 million on preparing for emergencies or on adaptation. Former auditor general Sheila Fraser, when reviewing this issue long ago, said the situation was “unacceptable”. Years later, Michael Ferguson did the same audit on the same issue, and said it was “beyond unacceptable”. Years after that, current Auditor General Hogan now says that we are decades into the failure to serve indigenous people. Her exact words are, “words are not driving change”. This is a problem we see with the government; it is big on announcements but zero on delivery.
For the needed infrastructure for first nations, the dedicated fund's annual amount is $12 million. There are 112 identified projects that are not funded yet, such as fixing dams, dikes and flood plains. I am sure the government will say not to worry; it is getting to them. Over two-thirds of them are over five years old, and 4% of them are over a decade old. Only $291 million is required to address all 112 projects. To put it in perspective, in the last two years alone, the government has paid $88 million directly to Tesla to subsidize wealthy people to buy electric cars, but $12 million a year is dedicated for infrastructure in first nations communities. We need actions, not words. We need a change of government for this.
577 words
- Hear!
- Rabble!
- add
- star_border
- share
- Dec/11/23 9:29:11 p.m.
- Watch
Madam Chair, I not only have the fortune of sitting with the member on the public accounts committee and share a city, but I also have the fortune to ask the member an important question.
When we studied the audit presented by the Auditor General in relation to emergency management, we heard the deputy minister, who was invited at that time, admit the fact that there was critical underfunding for the preparedness of indigenous nations in direct relation to how prepared they were for natural disasters. As a matter of fact, the deputy minister even confirmed that she told the minister to spend more money. What did the minister do? She denied it.
I would ask the member to speak to the fact that the deputy minister themself seems to be doing what is right, but the minister is not. Can he explain why?
144 words
- Hear!
- Rabble!
- add
- star_border
- share
- Dec/11/23 10:39:06 p.m.
- Watch
Mr. Chair, I appreciate the opportunity to stand and continue this debate as we look into indigenous services and, in our opinion, the absolute failure of this department in many sectors.
I want to ask the member opposite if he would like to comment more on the Auditor General's report. The Auditor General is “frustrated that almost a decade later, there has been little to no improvement.... Indigenous Services Canada still has not identified which First Nations communities most need support to manage emergencies”. She says that if the department did identify these communities, it would target its investments accordingly, which of course, as we have pointed out in this debate, has not been happening.
There are 112 infrastructure projects on the minister's desk that would help first nations leaders stay on their land in the event of an extreme weather event, but the government refuses to move forward to start to improve these conditions. I wonder if the member can comment on that.
168 words
- Hear!
- Rabble!
- add
- star_border
- share
