SoVote

Context: House Hansard - 305 - Apr/30/24

Apr/30/24 11:30:49 a.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I was at breakfast this morning with members of the insurance industry, who outlined exactly their view of this pharmacare program. They said that the monies committed just in this budget alone would provide the full formulary for all the drugs missing by those not covered under other drug plans. They then outlined all of the risks of people dropping their other plans and switching to a public plan. The dollars are going to go into the public purse as opposed to actually helping the people who do not have coverage. If the definition of deplorable is handing the government a balanced budget when it took power, I will take deplorable every day.

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Mr. Ziad Aboultaif (Edmonton Manning, CPC)

Apr/30/24 11:31:38 a.m.
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Mr. Speaker, the people of Edmonton Manning have been very clear in the emails I have received in the past two weeks. Franks says, “Stop spending our money like a drunken sailor, we cannot afford the debt.” Trevor tells me, “It is absolutely ridiculous as to how much tax Canada is being charged, where does it stop?” David asked me to “Please put pressure on the P.M. to start cutting Canada's debt and balancing the budget.” Mariette says, “This budget puts our kids further into debt.” Michael writes of his “utter disgust with the latest Federal Budget.” The feelings are unanimous: This budget is a disaster. I can only conclude that no one in the government actually considered the contents. Maybe they were too busy watching television to think about managing the country. I must confess that I do not watch much television. When I do, I watch documentaries or live sports events. Two of the things that I avoid completely are reality television and game shows. To me, there is very little reality involved, and the games do not seem to be all that real to me. As a result, I have to admit that I have never watched the show Are You Smarter Than a 5th Grader?, which aired more than 15 years ago. It was a short-lived program with only five episodes made. The idea was to have a panel ask questions from elementary school textbooks to see if the contestants were smarter than a fifth grader. The top prize was a million dollars, tax-free. The idea probably offends the Liberal members opposite. They do not believe that anything should be tax-free, ever. Contestants on the show have to answer questions about Canadian history, Canadian geography and Canadian culture. However, history, geography and culture were not the only categories covered on the show. There was also mathematics, which may be the reason no Liberal MP ever appeared on the program. When it comes to math, budget 2024 shows very clearly that the Liberals are nowhere near as smart as a fifth grader. When children are in fifth grade, math is pretty simple: addition, subtraction, multiplication and division. It is not rocket science. Fifth graders know that if they receive a weekly allowance from their parents, they must spend that money wisely. Common sense tells them that they cannot spend more than they have. There is no such thing as deficit spending to a ten year old. If they spend all their money, Mom and Dad will tell them that they have to wait until next week to get any more. They are not made of money. They have to live within their means and they expect their children to learn how to do that also, especially as they feel financially stressed by all the extra taxes the government has piled on them. If children want some shiny toy that costs more than their weekly allowance, then they have to learn to save until they can afford to buy it. Stores are reluctant to extend credit to a ten year old, especially one who has not learned the value of saving. As I look at this budget, I wish the Minister of Finance could go back in time and become a fifth grader once again. It is apparent that she and the Liberal Party failed to learn some important lessons in childhood, and now it is all Canadians who are paying for their inability to understand basic math. A fifth grader could tell us that money does not magically appear. It does not grow on trees. We cannot just pick up loose bills on the sidewalk. A fifth grader could tell us that spending more money to pay the interest on the national debt than we have for health care is a recipe for disaster. Adding more debt does not fix the problem. I will not delve deeply into economic theory here. However, the Prime Minister has asked Canadians to forgive him for not thinking about monetary policy, and it would probably be wrong of me to expect his caucus to have any more interest in such matters. I must say, though, that there have been some changes over the past eight years in the way the government approaches its responsibility to manage the nation's finances. No longer does the government think it is possible to pluck numbers out of thin air, put them in a spreadsheet and magically produce a budget that balances itself. Fifth graders could tell us that a deficit is not just a line on a piece of paper. It is a debt, borrowed money that has to be repaid at some point. They would also tell us that until that debt is paid interest will be charged. In simple terms that even a Liberal could understand, running a budgetary deficit costs money. If interest has to be paid on a debt, then there is less money for the things that government is supposed to do for Canadians, things like health care. Where does the government find money to pay its debts? It raises taxes. In other words, it charges Canadians for something they did not ask for and for some reason expects them to be happy to pay. Parents who explain to their fifth graders how important it is for individuals and families to live within their means are being undermined by a government that spends and spends, while expecting someone else to pay its bills. This budget would increase government spending and taxes and would bring us no closer to a balanced budget than we have been at any time in almost nine years of Liberal fiscal mismanagement. Apparently the Liberals' coalition partners in the NDP approve of this highway of economic ruin. This budget would bring in $40 billion of costly new spending that Canadians cannot afford. In 2022, the finance minister said that the budget would be balanced by the year 2027. In 2023, the date was revised to 2028. Why do the Liberals not just admit that they have no idea how to balance the budget, since magic is not working? Before the Liberals were elected in 2015, their leader suggested that perhaps his government would run modest deficits, about $10 billion annually before returning to the balanced books that he inherited from the previous Conservative government. We all know what happened. Record deficits followed record deficits to create a national debt never seen before in the history of Canada. With this latest budget, the Liberal-NDP government is farther than ever from doing so. What we have now is a government that will spend more money next year servicing the debt than on health care. There is no sense in that, except perhaps to the members opposite. Canada's per capita GDP is now lower than it was six years ago. While other countries have grown their economies, Canadians are poorer. The government's solution is inflationary spending and more taxes. It needs to go back to the fifth grade. There is a glimmer of hope. Soon we will have a Conservative government with members who are indeed smarter than a fifth grader. Conservatives will balance the books, making the spendthrift finance minister and her fiscally unaware boss a bad memory. The common-sense Conservative plan will axe the carbon tax, balance the budget and build homes, not bureaucracy, to bring lower prices to Canadians. Even a fifth grader knows that the Liberal government is not worth the cost.

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Mr. Adam van Koeverden (Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Environment and Climate Change and to the Minister of Sport and Physical Activity, Lib.)

Apr/30/24 11:41:04 a.m.
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Mr. Speaker, like most members of Parliament, when I am home for the week, I usually get out and do a couple of school visits. Last week, I was lucky enough to go to Martin Street Public School, and I heard from some really smart fifth graders. To hear the member opposite suggest that fifth graders are not intelligent or do not have any business, suggesting that we should engage with them, I strongly disagree— Some hon. members: Oh, oh!

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Mr. Mark Gerretsen

Apr/30/24 11:41:40 a.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I rise on a point of order. The Conservatives seem to have taken offence to that and are now heckling the member on his assertion that fifth graders do understand a lot and can contribute. Perhaps you could ask the Conservatives to keep the heckling down so the member can properly ask his question.

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The Deputy Speaker

Apr/30/24 11:41:53 a.m.
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That is getting into debate. The hon. member for Prince George—Peace River—Northern Rockies.

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Mr. Bob Zimmer

Apr/30/24 11:41:56 a.m.
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Mr. Speaker, the point made by my colleague was that the fifth graders were smarter with financial decisions than the government. That was the point.

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The Deputy Speaker

Apr/30/24 11:42:08 a.m.
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We are descending into debate. The hon. member for Courtenay—Alberni is rising on the same point of order.

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Mr. Gord Johns

Apr/30/24 11:42:14 a.m.
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Mr. Speaker, it is so hard to speak at this end of the House without getting heckled by Conservatives. It is next to impossible to even hear someone next to us. This really needs to be addressed.

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The Deputy Speaker

Apr/30/24 11:42:31 a.m.
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I appreciate that, but I am also hearing a lot of heckling from all corners in the chamber. I will remind everyone who happens to be in the chamber, including Conservatives, the NDP, the Liberals, the Greens and the Bloc Québécois, on occasion— Some hon. members: Oh, oh!

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Mr. Adam van Koeverden

Apr/30/24 11:43:09 a.m.
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Mr. Speaker, my point is that an average fifth grader knows that it is unproductive to heckle, name call and denigrate people on the basis of how much one person knows or another person knows. Does the member not know that it is the job of the Bank of Canada and the Governor of the Bank of Canada to think about and consider monetary policy? It is not so much the role of government to talk about and think about monetary policy. I know the Conservatives have made much hay out of the Prime Minister's statement that it is actually the job of the Bank of Canada to talk about and think about monetary policy and that it is the federal government's job to make economic policy, fiscal policy and decisions on spending. The fifth graders of Martin Street Public School know the difference and perhaps the Conservatives could learn fifth grade civics, because that is where we learn about the jurisdictions of the various institutions in our government and country.

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The Deputy Speaker

Apr/30/24 11:43:09 a.m.
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If we want to talk about heckling in the House, I will remind people that they should not be heckling the Speaker. I would also remind people to be judicious in their discussions and, of course, to keep the chatter down in the chamber. The hon. parliamentary secretary.

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Mr. Ziad Aboultaif

Apr/30/24 11:44:06 a.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I would excuse the hon. member opposite. It is like the Prime Minister asking him to sell a radish as a strawberry. They are trying to convince Canadians of their mismanagement and inability to balance the budget whatsoever. This is the situation. Philosophically, if the Prime Minister does not think about fiscal responsibility and fiscal or monetary policy, what does he think about? This— Some hon. members: Oh, oh!

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The Deputy Speaker

Apr/30/24 11:44:41 a.m.
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The problem is that members are still heckling everybody all the time. The hon. member for Edmonton Manning.

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Mr. Ziad Aboultaif

Apr/30/24 11:44:55 a.m.
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Mr. Speaker, the Liberals are complaining about the Conservatives heckling. They are heckling because they do not accept any logic, reality or truth. This is the shape of a government with which we are dealing. If their Prime Minister does not think about monetary policy, that means we are in trouble and we are, indeed, in trouble because of that type of thinking.

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Mr. Blake Desjarlais (Edmonton Griesbach, NDP)

Apr/30/24 11:45:20 a.m.
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Mr. Speaker, grade 5 students certainly know a lot. The students in the member's riding of Edmonton Manning asked me a simple math question, which I will ask the member. The member said that the Conservatives were going to axe the carbon tax. Let us do the math on some of this tax in Alberta when it comes to fuel. Three cents is the Government of Canada's carbon tax. Four cents is the United Conservative Party of Alberta's fuel tax, but gas went up 20¢. Therefore, who gets rich from the 13¢ that the member never talks about? Who is getting the 13¢? Could the member do the math on that?

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Mr. Ziad Aboultaif

Apr/30/24 11:46:06 a.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I do not think we are speaking of two types of residents. I receive so many complaints from Canadians, from Albertans, from my riding and from his riding, my neighbour riding, about the carbon tax. The hon. member needs to convince his own constituents about the carbon tax and explain how crazy life has become since it was increased. He and his party have supported the government in increasing the cost of living for Canadians, as well as the cost of groceries. If the member can convince his own people in Alberta, then I will be satisfied.

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Mr. Robert Kitchen (Souris—Moose Mountain, CPC)

Apr/30/24 11:46:53 a.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I have also received many letters from my constituents about the same issues. They talk about how disgusted they are with this budget. The reality is that they see it as unfair. Part of what they talk about is how the government is promoting fairness, yet the Liberals have failed to mention that when they came into power, the national debt was $600 billion. Now, it is $1.2 trillion, and when looking at the budget, it says that in five years the national debt will be up another $280 billion. That does not seem fair to the gen Z and the millennial Canadians as they progress five years down the road because they are going to have to pay for it. Could my colleague comment on that?

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Mr. Ziad Aboultaif

Apr/30/24 11:47:46 a.m.
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Mr. Speaker, there is no fairness in making people's lives miserable. There is no fairness in making people's lives unaffordable. There is no fairness when people cannot buy food to feed their kids. There is no fairness in what the government is doing, and they must stop. This is what Canadians are asking us for. This is what my constituents are asking me for.

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Hon. Judy A. Sgro (Humber River—Black Creek, Lib.)

Apr/30/24 11:48:14 a.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I am very glad to stand today to give some comments on this very important budget, which really is a framework as we are moving forward. I am very pleased to share my time with the member for Dorval—Lachine—LaSalle, a former member of our international trade committee, who we miss at the committee now, but she has moved on to other things. I have been speaking over this past weekend, especially with my constituents, with other community leaders and with family and friends, about the budget because—

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The Deputy Speaker

Apr/30/24 11:48:54 a.m.
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I know there is some debate going on in the chamber. I would ask those individuals who are having an extra debate or a continued debate to take it outside into the lobbies. Of course, they are not listening to me because they are into that debate. Maybe the hon. member for Edmonton Griesbach and the hon. member for Edmonton Manning would take their conversation outside. That would be great because we do have somebody chatting. The hon. member for Humber River—Black Creek.

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