You can stop.

Like you said.

In Oshawa, we had a couple of make-the-news stories, which I have shared in talking about this bill before, about the kangaroo that came to visit. It was also not part of this bill, but some of the conversation that came from this visiting kangaroo that was on the lam, so to speak, in Oshawa was, what on earth is a kangaroo doing in Oshawa? It brought some attention to roadside zoos: the lack of oversight, the challenges both for veterinarians and people who deal with animal care.

This is a bill that we don’t have a problem supporting, but there are other opportunities for this ministry, for this government, to make strides in caring in a better way for more animals, especially the roadside zoos being one example. What are some other things that you’ve heard?

Like we said.

I give the minister credit. When they found that out, equipment went in; they dug and stopped that.

But that was a fully approved site. And it wasn’t 20 years ago. It was approved with that concrete in the plans—in the plans. Now, rightfully so, in my opinion, there are members of the public who have lost faith in the ministry’s ability to monitor that site, so now they’re asking—the comment period just closed. For the first time in 12 and a half years, our office actually commented in the comment period. I don’t know if that’s proper, actually. But the reason I did it is because the first two times I asked the question, both times the response was completely wrong—it wasn’t even “we’ll look into it”; it was “nope.” So, now, every time when they say there’s no problem, we don’t buy it. The comment period is over. We want to know, how does the ministry ensure that when raw human sewage is spread on those fields that the crops from those fields don’t end up in the human food chain? We don’t have direct access to those answers. I think that’s something we need to know. Just having the ministry say, “Everything is fine, folks”—fool me once, my fault; fool me three times—and I’m not criticizing the ministry, not really, not at all. I believe that the people who work for the ministry are doing everything they can. But the rules, to me, aren’t clear. So we don’t know where those crops are going. We do know that the company that did the spreading was fined for spreading at the wrong time. I’m a farmer by trade. They spread that liquid human sewage under conditions that no competent farmer would ever spread human sewage—

Actually, I agree with that—I said that before I started—since I know where that advice came from.

The new member from Milton, in his speech, talked about how one political issue had made him end up coming here, and I had the same thing. Actually, one of the people who I called told me to find something better to do with my time, and that was also the member from Oxford. That’s why I’m here.

But anyway, in closing, we made it very clear with second reading, we made it very clear in the committee, we’re making it very clear now: We are in favour of this act. It makes changes that people have needed in the veterinary industry, in the agriculture industry and people who have pets. These changes are good for the people who work with those animals and for the people themselves. So, with that, we are happy to support.

My final closing is that I hope that the government learns from this: that you bring good legislation forward, directed legislation, and, actually, it will result in good results for the people of Ontario. We may disagree in philosophy on some things; that’s fine. But a good piece of legislation is a good piece of legislation, and this is.

One other comment: We should look not at lowering the bar, but at expanding the bar to people who have practical experience, because there are some people are more cut out to be a large-animal vet. We need to do that. We need to find a way to do that. I don’t want to lower the bar, but to broaden the life experience bar.

Point of order.

I recognize the Minister of Agriculture, Food and Rural Affairs on a point of order.

I can’t believe we just talked about poop for the last 10 minutes in the Ontario Legislature, but here we are on Monday afternoon.

I wanted to give you a little bit more time to elaborate on the partnership with University of Guelph and Lakehead University, because we both agree it’s really, really great to be able to see that partnership, fostering more seats in the north and having those people stay in the north. I’m going to talk a little bit later in my remarks about my uncle, who was a large-animal veterinarian in the north. I just want to give you the opportunity to expand a little bit on that.

I would like to thank my friend from Timiskaming–Cochrane for an engaging and entertaining, but also genuine and forthright, presentation. I think it’s important that we give credit where it’s due—although I would say that we don’t see much credit coming from the government towards us in the official opposition, and I think our scorecard is quite a number higher in that regard.

I also want to commend the committee and commend the member for recognizing the work of the committee, getting Gay Lea and Parmalat to pull Thornloe Cheese from the fire. It’s a shame that the member couldn’t pull Jack from underneath the two-by-four in time, but that remains to be seen.

With Bill 171, we see that the government has engaged in years of open and transparent public consultation. How is this unlike many other pieces of legislation that this government has put forward?

Next question.

I’d like to thank the member from Oshawa for that question. There’s actually a movement in northern Ontario and northeastern Ontario to try to get the government to take a closer look at roadside zoos. I referred to it: First you had a kangaroo. We had a baboon get loose in Latchford, and it bit a lady. Latchford is a very small community; it doesn’t have an animal control bylaw officer. It’s a pet, so how do you deal with that? Should someone whose baboon gets loose have a baboon, quite frankly?

Anyway, thank you for bringing that forward. I think the government needs to look. I know that the municipality of Kirkland Lake and many other municipalities have put forward resolutions to try to get the government to take steps to do something about roadside zoos.

Jack lived for two years after, and Jack loved my wife and never liked me. He didn’t like me before the surgery; he didn’t like me any better after, but he did follow me around all the time. He was a valued member of our family for 13 years.

I will stick to agricultural issues. On some issues, they lack a consultative process. On land use, they seem to completely lack a consultative process. They’ve had to rescind bills, like the greenbelt—completely rescind legislation—even though we are in a process, in a place, where that shouldn’t happen. We can disagree philosophically, but to have bills, to have policies that are so egregious to the public that the public forces the government to change direction—they don’t understand consultation.

Another quick one is when it became that they were going to allow three severances per agricultural lot. Again, there was no consultation on that at all, and that is a huge problem.

We understand that to provide a service, companies that make medication, companies that provide things need to make a profit. You’re not going to do something to lose money. We understand that. But if you look at the profit margins of many corporations, perhaps the government needs to look how the undue gouging, or gouging at all, can be prevented.

Two million.

Three-hundred thousand.

I thoroughly enjoyed the presentation from the member from Timiskaming–Cochrane. He mentioned his experience where he had had an injured animal and he had to take steps to nurse that injured animal back to health, and that kind of made him transition from a farmer to a pet owner.

I would like to hear the rest of the story. I would like to hear what happened with the animal after the animal’s leg was wounded and after it had healed. What happened to the animal after that?

I would like to advise you I will be sharing my time with the lovely member from Etobicoke–Lakeshore, my seatmate.

It has been a good chunk of debate—not bad for a Monday afternoon. I always appreciate when we have excellent discourse here in the Ontario Legislature. I’m going to just read some prepared remarks here for a second, but then I want to talk about some family members because I think it’s always important to bring a little bit more context to how a lot of the bills and legislation and things we do hit home a little bit more.

I did just want to say that the agricultural industry in Waterloo region is alive and well. According to the 2021 census, Kitchener–Conestoga is home to 107,134 people. But did you also know, Madam Speaker, that it’s also home to 111,242 pigs? My constituents are also outnumbered by chickens. Would anyone like to guess how many chickens we have in Kitchener–Conestoga?

Ontario cares about protecting the health and well-being of animals and understands the important roles animals play in our families and the important role that agriculture plays in our economy. Our government is working to increase access to veterinary care services for pets and their owners as well as farmers. Based on extensive consultations—and I want to thank the Minister of Agriculture, Food and Rural Affairs. We heard today from members of the opposition as well that there was a great consultation on the ways to modernize the laws governing the veterinary profession and improve access to care in Ontario.

Thusly, we’re here today talking about the proposed Enhancing Professional Care for Animals Act. If enacted, this would enable the creation of a formal scope of practice for veterinary technicians that would allow them to practise to their full potential and their training and expertise. It would also lead to the creation of requirements for continuing education similar to other regulated professions. It would streamline the complaints resolution process to allow disputes to be addressed more quickly. It would increase penalties to better reflect the seriousness of actions that could harm animals and also ensure greater public representation on the council of the regulatory college overseeing veterinary professionals.

I wanted to—again, like I said—bring in some of that more local and, in this case, this interesting familial content to debate here today. I’m actually very lucky to have two family members—my Uncle Chuck, who was a large-animal veterinarian in northern Ontario who was a large part of the Canadian Food Inspection Agency and worked with the government of Canada; and also my wife’s aunt, Pauline van Veen, who was a small-animal vet who worked in many different parts of the province. I actually, a while back when we had started discussions about what was going to happen with veterinary services in Ontario and looking at some of the different acts that the minister has put forward over the last little while in regard to animal welfare—we talked a lot about the PAWS Act. I brought them into the conversation, because I thought it was important.

One of the things that came up was talking about training and barriers to training. I want to commend our government and all of those who have been part of this process, because there’s a new incentive program in place that provides a maximum of $50,000 for up to 100 recently licensed veterinarians to practise large-animal medicine in underserviced areas. That is crucial to getting new folks interested in this profession—this trade, if you will—because finances are always a barrier when you’re starting new. And especially in medical professions—these are medical professions that we’re talking about—you don’t just go to school for a year, complete the program and then go and practise. There’s a lot that has to go into this. It was actually neat, because my Uncle Chuck had suggested something along these lines. How do we remove some of these financial barriers? How do we make it easier for folks to get into this profession? And we actually did it, which was great to see. Again, this is because of the fulsome consultation that the minister has put forward—and her team, of course: her parliamentary assistants and staff within the ministry. It’s great to see some of these things come forward.

I also want to talk a little bit about the 2023 budget. The government announced $14.7 million over two years, starting this year in 2024-25, to allow an increase in enrolment in veterinary schools—and we’ve heard this talked about a little bit today—to 20 new seats, which is fantastic. Seeing these new partnerships with Lakehead University and the University of Guelph—I actually had the opportunity to attend that announcement with some colleagues and the minister at the University of Guelph, and it was so well received by the veterinary community, the agriculture community, because farmers in northern Ontario and other underserved areas are now going to be able to rest easy, rest assured that, when they wake up in the middle of the night and they’re birthing calves and who knows what the night is going to entail, if they need to make a phone call and they need to talk to that vet or that vet has got to come over and assist with the process, there’s actually going to be someone on the other end of the line that’s going to be able to assist, that’s going to be able to really take a load off their shoulders.

Any of us that have agriculture in our communities and get out and talk to our farmers know that life can be pretty stressful. It’s not easy being a farmer. It’s not easy having the weight of your community on your shoulders, being out there really trying to feed your loved ones, to feed the community around you and really put your best foot forward. We’ve seen a lot of great initiatives around mental health. We’ve seen a lot more of a community spirit and a rallying around to say to your neighbours, “If you’re having trouble, it’s okay. Let’s talk. Let’s talk farmer to farmer. We don’t need to necessarily be out there airing your dirty laundry, if you will, but I’m here for you. Let’s have those discussions.”

When you take all of the sum of all the parts and put them together, we’ve really started to knit a fantastic fabric. When it comes to agriculture and especially this ministry, there have been so many great things that have been done. This is another piece of that puzzle, Madam Speaker. I think that we’re really on the right track when it comes to making sure that we’re able to put food on the table, making sure that our farm animals are happy and healthy, but also that our farmers are happy and healthy. It’s something that I am very happy to get behind.

I’m now going to pass my time over to my colleague.

It’s my pleasure to rise in the House today to join the debate on Bill 171 and the importance of enhancing professional care for animals.

Speaker, our government, under the leadership of Premier Ford, is committed towards developing a modern and robust animal welfare ecosystem with laws that keep our animals safe and their owners reassured. The proposed Enhancing Professional Care for Animals Act is part of a series of steps we’ve taken and will continue to take in this direction.

Just last month, I had the pleasure to join the debate on Bill 159, Preventing Unethical Puppy Sales Act, which was brought forward to stop harmful dog-breeding practices and impose stringent penalties on violators. The PUPS Act addressed an important policy issue spotlighted in my very first private member’s bill here in the House, called Protecting Our Pets Act.

And today, this House is taking decisive action towards updating the legislative framework that governs veterinary services in this province. The changes we are debating are much-needed to increase access to veterinary care in Ontario, but most importantly, they answer the requests that veterinary professionals and animal owners have been bringing forward for years. We have arrived here after a long journey involving multiple and meticulous discussions with stakeholders across the province. I’m proud that our government has put our shoulders to the wheel in this process.

Exactly a year ago, in May 2023, I was happy to host a round table with vets in Etobicoke–Lakeshore, with my colleague Rob Flack, who is now the Associate Minister of Housing. Then, he was the parliamentary assistant to the Minister of Agriculture, Food and Rural Affairs. He was there to help lead the consultations, along with my colleague from Eglinton–Lawrence. The discussions we held on modernizing the Veterinarians Act have allowed us to stand here with a better understanding of how to strengthen the tools needed by veterinary professionals to do a better job.

Before I move further, I just want to take this opportunity to recognize those stakeholders and partners from my community of Etobicoke–Lakeshore who joined me that day in May 2023. I want to thank them for their work in providing care for our animal companions. I want to acknowledge the tireless animal welfare advocates, such as the Etobicoke Humane Society, Toronto Kitten Rescue, TinyPurring.

And I’ll give a shout-out to Dr. Spence and Dr. Hume from the Islington animal clinic, who see myself and my pets far too often. But that’s the nature of being a pet owner. We are there, and they’re always there to help—just having those conversations with them.

There is always more we can do, and I think this bill is the right step in the right direction.

Speaker, it’s 2024, and we cannot bank on a law first introduced in 1989 to protect the best interests of our pets and pet owners in this province. The Veterinarians Act needed a 2024 reboot. And that’s exactly what we’re doing here. We proposed a law that aims to strengthen governance, transparency and oversight of veterinary care in Ontario.

The Veterinarians Act does not formally recognize the role of veterinary technicians—and a shout-out to all those great vet techs out there. You do an amazing job. You calm the animals down when we bring them in. Sometimes you get to give them a treat. You weigh them. You do a lot of hard work, and I just want to say thank you for all the hard work you do. I know we’re going to give you some more work to do in the future. So congratulations for the work you do right now.

This year, the Toronto Humane Society published a study on accessing veterinary care—it’s over a 13-year period—that speaks out about the relative shortages of vets across Canada. So it’s not just an Ontario problem. Our government is aware of the shortage of vets in parts of the province, particularly in rural Ontario.

Our response, through this bill, is to recognize that vet techs are ready to step up and share the burden. It’s time, as Minister Thompson put it, to switch to a “one team, two professionals” approach to deliver animal care that is relevant to the times that we live in.

Speaker, everyone has heard me mention my two pets at home, Bruce and Edward. I have, as I mentioned, an amazing veterinarian. Actually, I have a team of veterinarians, because Bruce has a ton of problems. Sometimes, it takes a village, I say, to raise these problem animals. He has allergies; he’s allergic to absolutely everything. He was a rescue dog, so we tried to figure out what was wrong with him. Special food, special diet—this works, this doesn’t work. Vet bills go up, vet bills go up, but my goodness, do we love that little boy to death, I’ll tell you.

Though this morning, he bit me because I was trying to cut his hair, and it didn’t quite work. He won that battle this morning. So, I took some gel and I slicked it back, because that was the battle I was going to take on.

I recognize the member from Etobicoke–Lakeshore.

It was a compromise.

Now, here are some stories about an amazing veterinarian. Last Christmas, presents were wrapped, sitting on the dining room table. I said “Okay,” went out, came home to get ready for church, see wrappers everywhere around the house, realized that Bruce unwrapped all the gifts, which were chocolate: Lindor chocolate balls in mugs for the party I was going to the next day. Anyway, I missed church on Christmas Eve, and Bruce and I headed to the emergency Mississauga vet. When I got there, he was actually the “Lindor chocolate dog,” because apparently there was a list of other dogs who were also into the chocolate on Christmas Eve. Always a fun place to spend your Christmas Eve.

But you know, it’s the kindest, kindest people there, and they see you; you’re in tears. You’re kind of a mess because your pride and joy is there, and what’s going to happen? The skills that they go through—the veterinarians, the vet techs, the people at the front—just to calm you down because we’re always getting nervous and we always want to make sure that our pets are taken care of. They do such great work.

I think it was about last week or two weeks ago; Guelph was here doing a lobby day in our dining room, and I had the opportunity to speak to some of the vet techs. They were so thrilled with the legislation that was coming forward. They said it’s about time they can do that work. We talk about nurse practitioners and how they help out doctors; this is sort of a similar thing, and I’m hoping that maybe this might help some of the costs going down, because you’re going to have a larger group of people who can help maybe give that shot or help you get your food or medicine or whatever. Whatever needs to be done, I’m hoping that will help the costs come down, because I know that sometimes our veterinary bills are a little bit high for many of us all across the province.

It’s important to note that we need to recognize the work that our vet techs do in animal care, and this proposed legislation works significantly toward improving access to veterinary care in Ontario. As the minister pointed out, that’s a welcome change being embraced by veterinarians and vet techs alike. So congratulations, Minister.

While better defining the scope of practice for veterinary medicine, the proposed legislation would also streamline the complaints and resolution process to allow disputes to be addressed more quickly. This addresses the public complaint that the complaint resolution process for veterinarians has taken far too long. If passed, the streamlined complaints process would include addressing investigations, professional misconduct and suspected incompetence. There will be mandatory reporting requirements if a licence holder suspects that another licence holder’s fitness to practise may be impaired. Where appropriate, more information will be available to the public and animal owners about practising vets and vet techs.

We always want to make sure our pets are safe. They can’t speak, so we just have to trust. So I appreciate this process just in case we need it. But I do know there are amazing vets out there. So, once again, we thank them for their work.

The legislation, if passed, would enable the regulatory college to develop a formal quality assurance program which will be overseen by a new statutory committee. The committee would set requirements for continuing education and refer cases of misconduct, incompetence or impairment to the college’s investigations and resolutions committee. All this comes along with increased penalties that will better reflect the seriousness of actions that can harm animals. Fines for taking actions that could cause serious harm to an animal without being licensed by the college would be set out in legislation. That’s a steep $25,000 for an individual on first offence, $50,000 for subsequent offences, $50,000 for a corporation on first offence and $200,000 for subsequent offences—good stuff. Good stuff, Minister. These proposed changes would ensure competence of members of the profession and further increase public trust.

As I said at the beginning, this legislation is not a stand-alone act, but one in a series of steps to strengthen the ecosystem of animal care in Ontario.

Now, I have already mentioned the PUPS Act. Before that, on January 1, 2020, our government enabled Canada’s first provincial animal welfare enforcement system, called PAWS. Ontario has the strongest penalties in Canada for people who violate animal welfare laws. For this, I am extremely proud.

Now, we want our province to have a robust and dependable veterinarian capacity. We are increasing enrolment into veterinary medicine with a $14.7-million investment to create 20 additional doctor of veterinary medicine seats. To address this critical shortage in rural and northern areas, we have launched the Veterinary Incentive Program, which provides $50,000 for up to 100 recently licensed veterinarians to practise large-animal medicine in underserviced areas. For those who live in rural and northern Ontario, we certainly know those are needed.

Madam Speaker, as a member of this House, a representative of Etobicoke–Lakeshore and a passionate advocate for animal welfare, I remain committed to spotlighting this issue. If you ever see an animal in distress, please call 1-833-9-ANIMAL. That’s 1-833-926-4625. That’s a hotline that’s been put in place, and there are people out there who will answer the phone to help out.

Once again, thank you for giving me the opportunity to speak on this important legislation. I can’t wait to pass this legislation. It’s great for our animals. It’s just part of a puzzle of animal welfare success in this province. Someone told me there has never been a government who has touched animal welfare in over 100 years. It’s a different time; let’s protect our pets out there and, number one, keep our pets safe.

Mine is a rescue. He came from a well-established rescue place. Of course, there’s always a place for volunteering your time to help out those animals in need. You don’t even have to be a vet tech or a vet; you could just be anyone helping out. But we want to certainly make sure that volunteering is available for all.

Maybe you should have called a tech.

So I’m going to ask him about chickens and whether he can tell us anything more about chickens in and around his area. I know, for example, in my area of Essex county, not only do we have people raising chickens, but we also have industries processing those chickens. That is an important part of Ontario’s incredibly safe and incredibly nutritious food chain. So I want to offer an opportunity to the member from Kitchener–Conestoga to make whatever comments he would like to make with regard to that.

Thank you to my colleagues across the aisle for talking about this. I know previously in debate there was a lot of focus on farming, because of the member who was speaking. I appreciate the conversation about pets.

I have two rescue dogs, and my wife really loves Petsave. One of the dogs came from Petsave. A lot of the work they do for these dogs who have been really abused, abandoned or just simply neglected is that they work with vet techs and veterinarians to provide the care and services they need. These vets and vet techs have the ability to donate their time to help these animals recover and have better lives.

I’m just wondering: In the bill, will this allow the flexibility for vet techs and veterinarians to be able to continue to provide these services or perhaps be able to do more of this sort of work?

Questions?