Hon. Marc Gold (Government Representative in the Senate): The government has nothing to hide, senator. Thank you for your question. My understanding is that the ministers to whom you referred all had prior commitments when they received the invitation from the committee. Officials from the Department of Justice and Public Safety Canada attended the meeting and provided the information that they were qualified to provide, and I trust that it was helpful to the committee. The government recognizes the important work that is undertaken by the committee and looks forward to the committee’s report on this important issue.

The Hon. the Speaker: Honourable senators, I wish to draw your attention to the presence in the gallery of Lynn Francis, accompanied by a delegation from the Elsipogtog First Nation. They are the guests of the Honourable Senator Hartling.

On behalf of all honourable senators, I welcome you to the Senate of Canada.

Hon. Patricia Bovey: My question is for the Government Representative in the Senate.

Senator Gold, the recent, unexpected and sudden firing of four senior staff members of the National Gallery of Canada has created controversy at home and internationally among artists, arts professionals and many donors. Three were long-time employees, one of more than 20 years. Their work, exhibitions, acquisitions, publications and specialized conservation has been widely acclaimed here and abroad.

Has the minister reached out to the interim CEO and board chair to gain an understanding that can be shared with taxpayers and the public as to why those decisions were made? What are the implications and consequences for the upcoming programs of Canada’s flagship and the gallery as a whole?

Senator Duncan: Thank you, Senator Gold, for that answer. I appreciate that much-needed changes do take time. I would also caution the Government Representative in the Senate that one size does not fit all in this country.

Can the Government Representative in the Senate please advise when we might see the development plan? Is there a time frame attached to the cabinet’s work?

Senator Gold: Thank you for your question.

As I have repeated on several occasions in response to this question, the government is of the view that its price on pollution and the other measures that are in place to secure and sustain the sustainability of those funds and programs that Canadians depend upon for their security are correct, prudent and responsible measures. It will continue to act accordingly.

Senator Plett: Senator Gold, the report in question also claims that the vast majority of the newly documented stations found around the world were set up starting back in 2016. Does the government have any knowledge of how early these stations began operations in Canada, or was this under the government’s radar for six years? Again, why are they still operating in Canada?

Senator Housakos: Government leader, with all due respect, the minister stood in a picture with him, knowing full well that this is a well-known anti-Semite. As I said, Senator Gold, this is not the first time that Liberals and Trudeau cabinet ministers of this government have been found sharing the stage with anti‑Semites and terrorist sympathizers.

My question to you, government leader, is the following: If you were allowed to participate in the national caucus of the governing party — which you should, given the fact that you are the government leader and represent the government in this chamber — would you advise the national Liberal governing caucus to stay away from well-known anti-Semites and terrorist sympathizers?

Senator Gold: Thank you for your question. I will take each and every one of those questions and refer them to the government and hope to get an answer in due course.

Senator Gold: Senator, I cannot answer that question for several reasons, not the least of which is that when and what Canada became aware of would have occurred through its security services. All senators will properly understand that those matters cannot be the subject of public disclosure.

The Hon. the Speaker pro tempore: Is it your pleasure, honourable senators, to adopt the motion?

The Hon. the Speaker: Is leave granted, honourable senators?

Hon. Pierre J. Dalphond: Honourable senators, I see that this item is at day 15. Therefore, with leave of the Senate, I ask that consideration of this item be postponed until the next sitting of the Senate.

Hon. Bernadette Clement: Honourable senators, I note that this item is at day 15. Therefore, with leave of the Senate, I ask that consideration of this item be postponed until the next sitting of the Senate in the name of Senator Lankin.

The Hon. the Speaker pro tempore: Is leave granted, honourable senators?

Senator Martin: First of all, thank you for your speech, and for giving us an understanding of the journey in arriving at this place with this bill. It has been a long time. I really appreciated your personal testimony, as well as helping us understand what is in the bill.

I will focus on what is not in the bill, and what we could perhaps consider in a study of amendments from this chamber.

You mentioned “Innuizing” a space. I thought I would start with a question related to the Inuit representation: Natan Obed, President of the Inuit Tapiriit Kanatami, a national Inuit organization, expressed his disappointment with this legislation at a press conference just last Friday. He said the bill could result in recommendations that may be completely out of sync with Inuit positions — with only one seat on a board of 9 to 13 people to be nominated by the organization. Mr. Obed believes that, had they been consulted when this legislation was first being considered, this would not have been the result.

I’m curious, senator, what would your response be to Mr. Obed and these concerns?

[Translation]

Senator Audette: I will be candid with you. I understand that position and reaction. I understand it. In a perfect world, when the bill was introduced in the other place, the democracy or power and discretion would have been left in the hands of our Indigenous leaders, who could determine whether one day we’re able to create something that meets the needs of the Inuit people, rather than creating large entities where we have to fight for a place among ourselves. Unfortunately, that divides us and puts us in situations where people are left wondering why them and not us?

In my heart, Mr. Obed has the right to share that message. We need to determine how we can then, when we are at the study and reflection stages, find something that he’s comfortable with or not, as a leader and an Inuit representative.

(1540)

Also, it’s important to remember that this organization must not take the place of existing relationships with the Minister of Crown-Indigenous Relations. Nation-to-nation governments must remain and be maintained, and this council must not interfere with that. If I were in a position to make recommendations, and I’ll leave that up to you to decide, I would say that we must ensure that the door remains open for nations to withdraw or return, and that we must respect their choice if they decide not to return.

[English]

Hon. Senators: Hear, hear.

Hon. Ratna Omidvar: Would the Honourable Senator Audette take a question?

[Translation]

Senator Audette: Yes, of course.

[English]

Hon. Marc Gold (Government Representative in the Senate): The amendments that were introduced were not done in a “sneaky” fashion; they were done in a committee in the other place. More importantly, the government will always respect hunters, sports shooters and Indigenous peoples and their traditions. The government is not targeting hunting rifles or shotguns.

I know there has been confusion on this point, so let me be clear. Many of the hunting rifles mentioned recently in the media are not being prohibited, and that includes the one that was a part of a well-known photo by a very well-known personality from my hometown of Montreal. This is largely a matter of misunderstanding where, for example, a common hunting rifle also has a high-powered version. It is only the high-powered version that would be prohibited under the amendments introduced into the bill.

Having said all of that, as the Prime Minister has made clear, he and the government are open to feedback to make sure that firearms mainly used for hunting are not included in the prohibition. The bill, which I hope we will receive and have the opportunity to study properly and fully as we have always done, is about the guns that were used in the massacre at l’École Polytechnique, in a mosque in Quebec City and in South Simcoe. This is a bill to protect safe communities for Canadians.

Senator Plett: Senator Gold, I asked about this issue 40 days ago. Canadians expect that the minister would have made decisions by now on how to remedy this outrageous situation.

For the minister to say that this period has stress tested the system and that it has exposed some areas of vulnerability is simply not good enough. Leadership is not about blaming others and giving excuses; it is about having a plan forward and ensuring that Canadians get the services and the assistance they deserve — services that they, frankly, pay for.

Senator Gold, I will repeat my question: What is the Minister of Transportation doing? What is your government doing to address this backlog? What is the plan to address the growing number of complaints at the Canadian Transportation Agency?