Senator Saint-Germain: Senator, I would like to begin by thanking and congratulating you and Senator Verner on your initiative, which I believe is worthwhile.

In her speech, Senator Verner talked about an “extraordinary process” that has never been attempted in the history of the Senate, which is true. However, because this is true, and notwithstanding the nobility of the cause and the strong desire that I myself may have to see this course of action against our former colleague happen quickly, I nevertheless believe that there is no reason to shut out senators who wish to contribute to the debate on this issue this evening and who would perhaps like to ensure the constitutionality of the motion being moved.

I don’t see any reason to deny them this opportunity, so why the rush to call for the vote immediately?

Senator Saint-Germain: Once again, I’m not saying I’m opposed to the objective, but, given senators’ right to express their opinion on such an important issue and given our responsibility to ensure that the motion is constitutional, I move adjournment of the debate in my name.

Senator Miville-Dechêne: Senator Verner and I have had that discussion. As you know, this was Senator Verner’s initiative, but of course I immediately agreed to second it. This is a difficult debate. It’s a debate that we don’t want to prolong, given the nature of the facts that have tarnished all of our reputations. The idea was to keep debate short and avoid adjourning debate so that there is no break. This has been dragging on and hurting us for a long time. The idea of having a short debate where we all agree is obviously an idea that I support.

However, I understand what you’re saying. I have a feeling, given that this story has been affecting us for a long time, that the senators have made up their minds. After all, is it so hard to agree that Senator Meredith does not deserve the title “Honourable?” It makes complete sense. The two reports that I have reread are devastating, and they were produced by our Senate Ethics Officer as a result of our internal mechanisms, so I feel that the issue is relatively simple.

I consulted people before drafting this text to make sure it avoided any potential legal pitfalls. Are there constitutional issues? I’m sure Senator Verner had this motion drafted by a trained law clerk. I am no legal expert, but on the face of it I see no constitutional problem. That’s my point of view.

Hon. Ratna Omidvar: I don’t wish to take any more points. I believe the point of my question was made, and it was more about the mechanics of Senator Plett’s proposal and exactly how it would work, given our true and tried principle of proportionality on the one hand, the fact that the Government Representative Office, or GRO, does not have an assigned number of seats on committees, nor do they have numbers of statements.

I’m wondering if you could explain your vision for all the non-affiliated senators being embraced by GRO as members of their caucus. I’m not quite sure how I would see that working.

The Hon. the Speaker: The sitting is suspended until 8 p.m.

(The sitting of the Senate was suspended.)

(The sitting of the Senate was resumed.)

(2000)

On the Order:

Resuming debate on the inquiry of the Honourable Senator McPhedran, calling the attention of the Senate to parliamentary privilege, the Ethics and Conflict of Interest Code for Senators and options for increasing accountability, transparency and fairness in the context of the Senate’s unique self-governance, including guidelines on public disclosure.

Senator Bovey: I’m not sure I like the word “end goal.” Surely, we should be looking at the word “future goal.” I wasn’t in the “good old Senate” — I know that. I never had any aspirations of being in the new Senate. Surprises happen in one’s life.

However, it must have been the case — and I hope you agree with me on this, Senator Plett — that not all the workings of the old Senate were necessarily “good old.” What I’m trying to get us to — and I hope you can agree with me and I asked you about this — is to agree to look for the future goal as opposed to the end goal. And as we do so, can we think about the needs of the ever-changing society and communities that we represent?

I would be interested if you do that, too, in our changing Manitoba. Remember, Manitoba was the “keystone” province, Senator Plett, so I come from the basis of that. Can we look at how the history of even our province changed the scope of Canadian Confederation and has changed the dynamics of this country that we call Canada?

Shouldn’t we be looking at how we can make this place a better place? As a chamber of sober second thought, don’t you agree with me that we have a responsibility to look at what that sober second thought is in terms of future goals?

Some Hon. Senators: Nay.

Hon. Marc Gold (Government Representative in the Senate): Thank you for your question and reminding us all that, although the hurricane came and went, its effects are still being felt with, in many cases, devastating consequences to our fellow citizens.

The Government of Canada is pleased to have partnered with the Red Cross, as it has done in the past, and pleased that Canadians have been so generous. The government is matching those funds, as you know.

I apologize for not knowing the details of the situation that you described. I will look into it as quickly as I can and report back to the chamber.

Senator Plett: That was an awfully long preamble, Senator Woo, and I am not consulting economists on this. I am making a speech that is contrary to what the government is doing, and I don’t need to defend that. They need to defend their bill. I don’t need to defend their bill.

You say it’s very difficult to reduce the GST, and then with that you said, “But your government did it.” So it’s not impossible. It might be difficult, but it’s not impossible.

Hon. Leo Housakos: While some of my colleagues — independent senators in this place — are preoccupied with why critics on government bills criticize and oppose government bills, I will continue to hold the government to account.

[Translation]

My question is for the government leader. Yesterday, an hour before a House of Commons committee meeting, someone let the cat out of the bag. Since 2017, the Liberal government has granted $21.8 million worth of contracts for facilities near Roxham Road to Pierre Guay, a Liberal Party of Canada donor. History is repeating itself. Liberals always benefit from the largesse of the Liberal government.

Sadly, Senator Gold, this comes as no surprise. The difference this time around is that, until yesterday, the Trudeau government refused to disclose the amount, claiming it was confidential information. In 2021, La Presse tried to get this information by submitting an access to information request to Public Services and Procurement Canada, but the request was denied.

Senator Gold, why did your government try to hide how much money it had paid to Mr. Guay? Are you ashamed? Is there any other information you’re hiding? Are other loyal Liberals taking advantage of this situation?

Senator Plett: Senator Lovelace Nicholas, I entirely agree with you, which is why I supported Senator McCallum in what she said. I believe that this chamber has been set up for minorities. We’re finding ourselves over here awfully close to being part of a minority as well. Of course, in the good old days we were not a minority. We’re still a few more in numbers than your caucus; nevertheless, we also find ourselves getting closer to a minority. But I support what you are saying.

(Debate adjourned, in the name of Senator Pate.)

[Translation]

Senator Plett: Whether it is end goals or future goals, some of us — and the one thing about the Senate is that we are allowed to talk about other people’s ages because anybody can look that up, and you and I are going to be retiring from here not that far apart — but for some of us, this has become looking toward the end as opposed to the future.

We have drifted a little bit away from what Senator McCallum was talking about, so I will simply leave it at that.

Hon. Raymonde Saint-Germain: Would Senator Miville-Dechêne take a question?

Some Hon. Senators: Yes.

Some Hon. Senators: Yea.

Hon. Senators: Agreed.

(Motion agreed to and bill read third time and passed.)

[Translation]

On the Order:

Resuming debate on the motion of the Honourable Senator Dawson, seconded by the Honourable Senator Bovey, for the second reading of Bill C-11, An Act to amend the Broadcasting Act and to make related and consequential amendments to other Acts.

The Hon. the Speaker: Honourable senators, I wish to draw your attention to the presence in the gallery of the family members of our new senator: her spouse, John Osler; her daughter, Juliana Osler; her son, Colin Osler; and her mother, Flordeliza Sharma. They are the guests of the Honourable Senator Osler.

On behalf of all honourable senators, I welcome you to the Senate of Canada.

The Hon. the Speaker: Honourable senators, I have the honour to inform the Senate that the Clerk of the Senate has received a certificate from the Registrar General of Canada showing that Flordeliz Osler has been summoned to the Senate.

Hon. Raymonde Saint-Germain: Honourable Senator Flordeliz Gigi Osler, all of my colleagues in the Independent Senators Group join me in wishing you the warmest of welcomes. We also welcome your family members. This will always be a very special day in your history. Our best regards to your family.

[English]

Senator, I would like to point out that you have demonstrated on several occasions how active and dynamic a woman you are, finding time not only to serve your patients but also to serve your professional association, in addition to sharing your knowledge and transferring your expertise to several universities in Canada and abroad. For the last several years, Dr. Osler, you have been volunteering in Africa to help train other surgeons in collaboration with the Massachusetts Eye and Ear Institute, Harvard University; University of British Columbia; University of Manitoba; and the Canadian Society of Otolaryngology-Head and Neck Surgery.

This would be impressive enough, but I’m not done with your very impressive résumé. As a dedicated advocate for equity, diversity and inclusion, your appointment is a continuation of a career in which your professionalism, integrity and competence have long served the public.

Senator Osler, when you were only and mostly known as Dr. Osler, you once said:

In my own work, I’ve come to realize how important it is to say to a patient who is about to have surgery, “We’re all here for you,” and give them confidence that they’re in good hands.

As this new chapter in your illustrious career begins, I couldn’t help but think about this sentence and how, despite your great expertise as a surgeon, you realize just how important it is to reassure your patients about what they are soon to undergo. On a larger scale, whether it is the Manitoban community, the Filipino one or all citizens of our country you will be representing in your new functions, I have no doubt that you will exercise your role with the utmost empathy, and our fellow Canadians will surely be confident that they are indeed “in good hands.”

Senator Osler, you will bring a unique perspective to our discussions, and I trust that you will keep in mind our duty to ensure the best interests of all Canadians with the care, the dedication, as well as the patience that have marked your career so far.

You have expressed your love of being in the operating room. This I don’t share with you, though. Although this might not look like one, the issues we deal with in this chamber can be delicate in nature and require rigour as well as precision. I have no doubt that you will succeed with flying colours.

Today, you are officially opening in the Senate a new chapter of your life. As this chapter is beginning, I wish to express how eager all members of the Independent Senators Group are to work with you. With your rich background, your proven dynamism and your modern and innovative approach — we saw it on TikTok indeed — we can only look forward to a tremendous contribution to the future of the Senate, especially with the great advantage of the time you have before you.

Senator Osler, welcome to the upper chamber.