44th Parl. 1st Sess.
February 28, 2022 11:00AM
- Feb/28/22 9:49:36 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, yes, we are working away at the defence committee, and in fact we were just there earlier this evening.
The member has made a very important point about something all Canadians should be proud of. We have had trainers in the region for some years now, and no doubt Canadians have had a big hand in Ukraine's readiness to fight.
One cannot put the heart in people; they find that themselves. However, what we have done and can do is continue to train those who stand up for democracy and face an actual threat, as Ukraine has been dealing with now for a long time.
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- Feb/28/22 9:50:28 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, I thank my colleague for her speech.
Given her familiarity with military matters, I would like her opinion on a proposal her party put forward earlier to expel the Russian ambassador to Canada and recall the Canadian ambassador presently in Russia.
Does she not think that any approach to conflict resolution requires at least some dialogue and communication? Does she think it would really be productive to expel an ambassador rather than maintain that contact?
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- Feb/28/22 9:51:10 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, yes, I do think the ambassador should be expelled at this point and that we should recall ours.
Yes, dialogue is always important, but this is a ruthless, tyrannical dictator who is now in charge of an enormous army, the second-largest military force in the world. He has shown over and over again that he is not interested in dialogue. He is not interested in talking. There have been all kinds of opportunities for that dialogue. I am always one who pushes for dialogue and for talking and not going that extra step unless we have to, but this person is not listening at this point. If he shows any indication at all of being willing to listen, there are avenues for us to make that happen.
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- Feb/28/22 9:52:10 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, I had the opportunity, on the European Union friendship committee we have in Parliament, to spend a few years on the Standing Committee of the Parliamentarians of the Arctic Region. My colleague mentioned the Arctic sovereignty we have as a neighbour of Russia in our north, and I wonder if she could elaborate a bit more in regard to the issues around the Arctic and our independence and making sure we stand our ground in that area.
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- Feb/28/22 9:52:45 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, on both sides of the aisle, everybody is talking about a need for NORAD modernization. I do not think that is news. What needs to be done is like the expression “use it or lose it”. As far as China and Russia are concerned, they have been very clear that they want to be the powers in the Arctic, whereas Canada believes we should be standing up for our Arctic, and that means all of Canadian sovereignty. We simply have to do more.
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- Feb/28/22 9:53:27 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, I will be sharing my time tonight with the hon. member for London North Centre.
I want to start by again thanking members of the opposition and from all parties for agreeing to this debate tonight, because were it not for our unity of purpose, we would not be having this discussion tonight.
I am rising to speak on an issue that none of us want to be talking about. It is as simple as that. We were here on January 31 talking about a possible threat of invasion of Ukraine. Just a few short weeks later, we are standing here worried about the threat of the use of nuclear weapons. I never thought I would see this in my lifetime. It is surreal in the extreme.
For the second time in two years, the world has come together to fight significant challenges. This time, it is to voice our response to aggression from one antagonistic individual who is actively, aggressively threatening democracy and attacking an innocent nation. We join the international response to Russia's invasion of Ukraine. We must send a very clear message to Russia that its flagrant violation of the UN Charter, of international law and of the sovereignty and territorial integrity of Ukraine will not be tolerated. In short, we stand with Ukraine.
We have heard a lot, tonight and over the past weeks, about how we have friends and constituents and colleagues from the Ukrainian community. We all do, and we are proud of that. I want to talk about some of my own personal experience.
I have lifelong friends in Anne-Marie Kurello, Tim Wolochatiuk, John Kozak. These are people I went to high school with. Anne-Marie Kurello, who is a friend to this day, sat beside me in grade 9 Latin. John Kozak, whom I have known since high school, sent me a text a couple of days ago thanking me, the government and Parliament for what we are doing to help Ukraine. I could feel the emotion as I was reading the words. My friend Tim Wolochatiuk, when we were in high school, would always take a day off to celebrate Ukrainian Christmas in January with his family. At the time, we just thought he was goofing off and skipping a day of school. I realized later that this was an important celebration for the Wolochatiuk family. I realize now how truly important that is.
I think about my friend and our former colleague, Don Rusnak, who represented the riding of Thunder Bay—Rainy River, or Fort William, where I was born. I am joined tonight by the current member. I went to the Prosvita club with Don a few years ago when I was visiting my hometown; I was born in Thunder Bay. It is a club where Ukrainian Canadians and Canadians of all walks of life come together to celebrate Ukrainian-Canadian heritage. It was a moment I remember now more than I did just a month ago.
Many of us in this chamber have welcomed young Ukrainian interns into our office. I have spoken of this before in this chamber. I think of them now. I reached out to one of them a few days ago. I sent him a message through social media. I simply said, “Are you okay?” His response was, “I'm fine, but I'm worried about my mother and my family and my friends. My mother is working in a hospital, and she's now subject to martial law.” I gave him my word that we would do everything within our power to help Ukraine and to make sure that his family and his friends are safe. I give that word to all of the interns who worked in my office and worked here on Parliament Hill.
Over the last number of weeks, I have attended many rallies. The member for Selkirk—Interlake—Eastman has been at a number of them. He has come to Toronto. I had the member for Thornhill in my riding on Friday outside the Ukrainian consulate. The member from Barrie was there last week. We are all part of these friendship groups.
Ordinarily we participate in these things and politically we are tripping over each other to show our support for our community more so than the other party, but now those groups have meaning. The Canada-Ukraine Friendship Group is the most important group on the Hill at this very moment. I have had the occasion to speak with some Ukrainian MPs over the past few days. I am sitting at home comfortable. They are not. They are fighting for their lives.
I am calling for unity in this House. Let us put partisanship aside. Let us lock arms. Let us work together, the government, Parliament, as MPs and do everything we can to stand with Ukraine.
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- Feb/28/22 9:59:22 p.m.
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Madam Chair, the speech by my colleague from across the aisle was a personal one in connection to what we are seeing unfold in the world today. I am with him in saying that I believe this House is united, that the parties are united, that Canadians are united. It has been wonderful to see the number of countries around the world calling out this horrific invasion and the tactics of Putin for what they are.
We have talked about military support and what is necessary for that, but one of the things we do not talk often about enough, I believe, is something that has been unfolding over the last few days. It is the impact of the economic sanctions that are immediately being felt in Russia. There has been strong support for removing Russian banks from SWIFT, the central bank, and numerous other economic sanctions that have an impact.
I would appreciate his comments on that, on how through globalization it presents some challenges, but there is an opportunity to make a difference in the situation.
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- Feb/28/22 10:00:23 p.m.
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Madam Chair, that is a very, very important question.
Everything has to be done. I can remember several years ago the former member of Parliament for Etobicoke Centre talked about removing Russia from the SWIFT system. That is being done now. Sanctions have been imposed on many of the oligarchs. They have been imposed on President Putin himself. I believe they are working. I believe we need to do more.
We are working with countries around the world. That is an important message in all of this. I used the phrase “arm in arm” earlier. The world is working together on these things collectively, consistently and together. It is working.
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- Feb/28/22 10:01:13 p.m.
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Madam Chair, I thank my colleague for his heartfelt and emotional speech. We do indeed feel a sense of unity. The Bloc Québécois has offered its full support to the government today, indicating that we want to work with the government, because this cause is much bigger than all of us.
I would like to know whether my colleague has anything to ask of the opposition. Are there any issues on which he wants us to continue to work together in order to reach the quickest and most peaceful solution possible?
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- Feb/28/22 10:01:53 p.m.
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Madam Chair, I genuinely want to thank the member for that question because one of the most powerful moments in question period for me today was when the first question posed by the Bloc was not “Why haven't you done this? Why haven't you done that?” It was “What can we do to help? What can we do to work together to help stand with Ukraine?” That was very powerful, so I thank her for the question tonight.
The answer is to talk to us, to support us, to give us ideas. There is no monopoly on ideas. I ask that not only of her and her party but also of all members in this House. We have to leave no stone unturned.
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- Feb/28/22 10:02:52 p.m.
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Madam Chair, we have heard today how the government has acted on things like automatically extending work visas and student visas for Ukrainians here in Canada. Again, we hear of the special relationship between Ukraine and Canada. We have so many Ukrainian Canadians. It is the biggest diaspora in the world and yet we do not offer visa-free travel to Ukrainians whereas 141 other countries do.
I am wondering if the member would consider proposing that to his party so that, at least temporarily, Ukrainians could travel to Canada in this very uncertain time.
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- Feb/28/22 10:03:43 p.m.
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Madam Chair, the short answer is yes, I will. I have. These issues have been discussed by me and all of my colleagues.
As the member knows, tomorrow is the first day of Irish Heritage Month and that is important to me. Ireland did just that last week. It is an issue that we are talking about. It is something I would like to see done.
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- Feb/28/22 10:04:13 p.m.
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Madam Chair, it is an honour for all of us tonight to come together and discuss this. I hesitate to use the word “debate”. It has been a very good discussion. We have seen a free exchange of ideas across the aisle. It is a testament to the fact that this issue does unify us.
Even in war, we find inspiration. We find so many examples of inspiration to draw upon in Ukraine, the way that its people and its leadership have stood up against the tyranny and carnage of the Russian regime and its president, Vladimir Putin. The people of Russia, it needs to be said, have shown enormous strength and courage. Let us make an important distinction between the regime of Putin and the Russian people. Thousands have been arrested. Thousands have been put into jail, and who knows what fate befalls them, but that courage needs to be recognized.
Canada has acted as it must. Sanctions against the Russian elite have been introduced, including against its president. Canada has come together with other countries, taking a leading role in helping bring countries together to block Russian banks from the SWIFT international payment system. Canada has also played a leading role in helping to bring countries together to support placing sanctions on Russia's central bank, and that is having an effect already. Canada is providing arms in the form of anti-tank weapons and ammunition, and as we saw yesterday, Canadian airspace has been closed to Russian aircraft.
We have contributed, but we must do more. We must do more for two primary reasons. Obviously, the bond between Canada and Ukraine is incredibly strong. There are many reasons for that, but I think migration is the key factor. Ukrainians have helped to build this country. There is no other way to put it. That is true particularly in western Canada, but it is also true in Ontario and it is true throughout the country.
I want to thank the Ukrainian community of London for its advocacy at this time. It has been a true honour to work with them to raise issues of concern in the past few weeks, and I will continue to do that. I know that members in this House feel the same way about their community leadership in their respective cities and towns.
I want to also point to the fact that Ukraine is at the front line. A colleague across the way who spoke about 20 minutes ago emphasized that Ukraine is now at the front line. He used those words “front line”. I go for that. Ukraine is indeed the front line of the battle against authoritarianism. It is the front line of where democracy has been put into question. We have a choice to make as western democracies and as elected representatives within western democracies on how this is going to be confronted.
Do we want to live in a world defined by the whim of a despot, or will we stand up, collectively, as individuals in this House, as democratic countries who believe in the rule of law, who believe in sovereignty, who believe in the rights-based and rules-based order that has defined the world and its international relations since World War II? That is precisely what is at threat. That is not hyperbole. That is not an exaggeration. It is the reality that faces us.
The need for democracy extends, though, beyond simply cherishing it as an inherent value. It is the great stabilizer in our politics not just domestically but internationally as well. It is a truism. It remains a truism that no two democracies have fought a war against one another. There is a whole theory around this called democratic peace theory. I only have about 30 seconds left, so I will not go into that. I can do it another time.
What I will say is that democracy as a stabilizer needs to be taken seriously. For that reason, I think we ought to look at putting more funding into our defence, of course, and helping promote democracy abroad. I was in Ukraine a few years ago and saw the great work that Canada has done in working with NGOs on the ground to promote democracy.
I look forward to questions.
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- Feb/28/22 10:09:01 p.m.
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Madam Chair, I am hearing overwhelmingly from people in my riding, those of Ukrainian origin and those who are not, about how much they want to help with the situation on the ground. There are three issues they have raised with me that I want to put to the parliamentary secretary.
The first is that they want it to be easier for them to send money to friends and relatives in Ukraine. Sometimes it can be very cumbersome to send money to family members overseas. I wonder if, as the parliamentary secretary for revenue, the hon. member could commit to looking into that issue and facilitating those remittances.
Another issue is that Canadians who have purchased supplies or donated supplies that could be useful for people in Ukraine want assistance in getting those over to Ukraine. Is the government in the process of sending supplies and is it able to assist with the transportation of donated goods?
The final issue is clarity for volunteers, those who want to volunteer and go over to help. Are they able to do that? What kind of support could they receive from the government?
I wonder if the parliamentary secretary could comment on those three issues.
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- Feb/28/22 10:10:05 p.m.
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Madam Chair, to that last point, obviously it is a dangerous time. That goes without saying. Individuals will have to think very carefully about what they do. I know there has been enormous interest expressed by individuals not just in Canada but throughout other democracies in going to Ukraine and assisting in the form of a volunteer force.
We saw something quite similar materialize during the Spanish Civil War, among other examples, but that is the one that stands out. If individuals wish to make that kind of contribution, that is up to them, but of course I emphasize the point that it is a dangerous situation and individuals have to think responsibly about their own safety.
On the other two points that were raised, I would be happy to speak with the hon. member. He did not point to any specifics, but through an email or a chat I would be happy to hear more about the identified challenges that he points to and have a conversation.
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- Feb/28/22 10:11:03 p.m.
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Madam Chair, today, a constituent in my riding of Vancouver East contacted our office. They have not been able to bring their loved ones to Canada. They have been stuck in the immigration system for more than two years because of the backlog in applications. Now that they are in this situation, obviously there is urgency. The quickest way for individuals to get to safety with their loved ones is visa-free access.
Why is the government not proceeding with that? What can we do as parliamentarians to help the government move in that direction and expeditiously bring about visa-free access for Ukrainians?
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- Feb/28/22 10:11:48 p.m.
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Madam Chair, the question of visa-free travel can be looked at and considered. I also point out to the hon. member that the government, in fact, has acted proactively, going back to January, by putting in place a plan to ensure that individuals in Ukraine who had applied to Canada for work permits, for example, would be given support to have their applications approved.
Individuals in Canada who are on a temporary resident visa, for example, or students will be able to stay longer for obvious reasons.
I think that all of us in the House look at those measures as entirely reasonable. We will continue to work together, I hope, to put to the government even more ideas about what can be done to ensure a reasonable approach that guides the way forward but one that has the well-being of all Ukrainians in mind at the forefront.
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- Feb/28/22 10:12:38 p.m.
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Madam Chair, I asked this earlier but I would like the opinion of the hon. parliamentary secretary. Will the government be considering going after the personal assets of the Russian oligarchs, including massive homes and mansions and yachts?
I know where one mansion is. It is in my riding and I would like it to be seized.
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- Feb/28/22 10:12:59 p.m.
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Madam Chair, I always appreciate the passion of the member, especially on this matter.
I think what Canada can do and ought to do, and I speak here as a member of Parliament but I join colleagues in this, is join other countries and explore exactly what has been suggested here. There is no doubt that the network of oligarchs in Russia has many assets abroad. If there are ways to address that and if there are ways to seize those assets and ensure they are not put to use by oligarchs who have surrounded the president to the detriment of the Russian people, then countries can discuss that and work among themselves for a resolution.
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- Feb/28/22 10:13:51 p.m.
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Madam Chair, God knows how much I wanted to believe in peace. I still believe in it today, because there is no other way out besides peace. We must remain hopeful that these rather strange negotiations currently taking place will bring an end to this conflict, and the suffering it is causing, as quickly as possible.
We must remember that during the previous take-note debate on the situation in Ukraine, our party and the government had some differences of opinion about the imminence of the conflict. Of course, those differences of opinion did nothing to prevent the conflict from breaking out. Ukraine has been unfairly attacked by Russia.
I told the Minister of Foreign Affairs that if conflict were to break out, the government could count on the full support of the Bloc and that we would stand in solidarity in terms of our desire to punish Russia and show our full support for the people of Ukraine. There is solidarity among us in the House, exemplary solidarity among the allies, and solidarity with the Ukrainian people, whose courage and resilience are truly admirable.
On Saturday, some colleagues and I met with Ukrainian colleagues. We spent a few minutes with some of them. One of our colleagues told us that the president and the deputies would stay in the capital. It would have been so easy for those parliamentarians to go back to their constituencies, to return to their families and the people they represent, but this is symbolic of how courageous Ukrainians are in the face of adversity, in the face of this unequal combat they are confronted with.
We simply have no choice but to support the Ukrainian people, first because this country is home to the world's third-largest Ukrainian community. These are people we connect with daily, who have family over there. We share and feel their anguish, their sadness, their concern.
We have no choice but to support the Ukrainian people because they have been subjected to an unfair attack that is also an attack against democracy, against freedom, against us.
Finally, we have no choice because the courage that the Ukrainian people are showing compels us to support them. We, by which I mean the Government of Canada and the west in general, have so far deployed a battery of measures to punish Russia, but also to punish Belarus, which has been complicit in the invasion of Ukraine. I mentioned today that we might want to take that a bit further.
As I said earlier, the Russians would not be at the gates of Kyiv if President Lukachenko had not allowed Russia to use his territory as a base to attack Ukraine from the north.
I have to say that I was, quite frankly, impressed by the speed and vigour of the response by western countries. I must admit that I had doubts. In the early hours of the invasion, we were hearing some reactions from Europe. Certain countries were saying that some of their companies should be excluded from sanctions, and that if Russian banks were banned from SWIFT they would have a hard time conducting transactions. It was starting to look like there might be a chink in the armour, which was worrying, but the west pulled itself together and the allies took action. We have to admire how quickly and strongly countries have responded, but there is still a lot to do.
I heard our Green Party colleague talk about certain oligarchs. Leonid Volkov, who is Alexei Navalny's chief of staff, appeared before the Standing Committee on Foreign Affairs and International Trade and told us that we needed to take action. He gave us a list of oligarchs who should be sanctioned. Several of those on the list have still not been sanctioned.
I am pleased to hear my colleagues in government tell us that everything is on the table. If the government decides to move forward with this, it will continue to have our support, because we must do more. We cannot tolerate this unacceptable aggression towards Ukraine.
We must definitely provide all our support to the Ukrainian people, as we have started doing. This means providing military equipment, non-lethal as well as lethal. Ukrainians need it, as they are facing the second largest army on the planet. We are also talking about foodstuffs, drugs and medical equipment. We must rise to the challenge and give Ukrainians what they need.
We must also welcome Ukrainian refugees. There are currently half a million of them gathered in neighbouring countries, and they are asking for help. The leader of the Bloc Québécois pointed out that if we can accept people at Roxham Road without a visa, why should we continue to enforce entrance formalities for Ukrainian refugees and make them complete all the formalities for receiving a visa? We must remove these requirements and make it easier for Ukrainians who wish to find refuge in Canada, temporarily or permanently, to enter our country.
We have to cut Russian propaganda off at the knees by removing Russia Today from Canadian airwaves. Speaking of Russian propaganda, the Russian people need to be informed. I cannot help but be amazed at the thousands of people in the streets of Moscow, St. Petersburg and other Russian cities risking arrest the moment they hit the streets to protest this war against a people that did nothing to deserve it, a people whose destiny they have shared for over 75 years.
Many Russians do not understand, and many of those who do not understand are speaking out against what they feel is unacceptable. How many Russian families will be bereaved? How many soldiers' bodies will be returned to their families as casualties of an unjust conflict?
As I said today, there may be hope in the Russia that is making itself heard today despite pressure from the powers that be.
In addition, as we heard from—
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