SoVote

Context: House Hansard - 265 - Dec/11/23

Dec/11/23 6:15:07 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, without the fanfare to which we have normally become accustomed, at this point I would simply request a recorded division.

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The Deputy Speaker

Dec/11/23 6:15:28 p.m.
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Pursuant to Standing Order 45, the division stands deferred until Tuesday, December 12, at the expiry of the time provided for Oral Questions.

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The Deputy Speaker

Dec/11/23 6:16:26 p.m.
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Pursuant to order made on Thursday, November 23, it is my duty to interrupt the proceedings and put forthwith every question necessary to dispose of the third reading stage of the bill now before the House. If a member participating in person wishes that the motion be carried or carried on division, or if a member of a recognized party participating in person wishes to request a recorded division, I would invite them to rise and indicate it to the Chair.

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Duty

Mr. Kevin Lamoureux

Dec/11/23 6:16:26 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I would request a recorded vote.

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The Deputy Speaker

Dec/11/23 6:16:37 p.m.
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Call in the members.

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Call

The Deputy Speaker

Dec/11/23 7:00:10 p.m.
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Re: Bill C-56

I declare the motion carried.

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All Topics

The Deputy Speaker

Dec/11/23 7:00:29 p.m.
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Pursuant to order made on Thursday, December 7, the House shall now resolve itself into a committee of the whole to consider Motion No. 32 under Government Business.

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The Chair

Dec/11/23 7:00:56 p.m.
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Before we begin this evening's debate, I would like to remind hon. members how the proceedings will unfold. Each member speaking will be allotted 10 minutes for debate, followed by 10 minutes for questions and comments. Pursuant to order made on Thursday, December 7, members may divide their time with another member. The time provided for the debate may be extended beyond four hours, as needed, to include a minimum of 12 periods of 20 minutes each. The Chair will receive no quorum calls, dilatory motions or requests for unanimous consent. We will now begin the take-note debate.

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Mrs. Jenica Atwin (Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Indigenous Services, Lib.)

Dec/11/23 7:02:01 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, I would like to begin by acknowledging that we are gathered on the unceded, unsurrendered territory of the Algonquin Anishinabe people. I would also like to preface my comments this evening by reminding colleagues in the House that we are not just talking about numbers or policies here. We are talking about people, communities, families and children, and what we do in this House really matters. It was my great honour to be here today as the Minister of Indigenous Services introduced Bill C-61, an act respecting water, source water, drinking water, waste water and related infrastructure on first nation lands. We do not always have good days in this House, but today was a good day. First nations have long called for legislation that affirms their inherent rights, recognizes their stewardship in keeping water clean and meets first nations' needs. Today, we collectively leapt closer to making access and security to safe and clean drinking water a reality. Before I came to the House, and I have spoken many times about my role in education, I was a teacher. I think about my time at Fredericton High School in particular. I used to teach my students about the ongoing water crisis here in Canada and what our nation was and was not doing to address it. I often pointed to the example of Shoal Lake 40 First Nation in Winnipeg. At the time, it was under 18 years of a long-term boil water advisory. Community members had to bring in large jugs. They could not brush their teeth, cook or bathe in the water. Then we built the human rights museum, and they could see this museum from their community. I always thought, “Whose human rights are we fighting for in this country?” I am so proud to say that Shoal Lake 40 First Nation has come off the long-term boil water advisory list. Everyone in Canada should have access to safe and clean drinking water. This simple and seemingly uncontroversial reality has been denied to first nations communities for centuries. It was only through the tireless advocacy of first nations partners and allies that this reality can come to be. This day belongs to them. Clean, safe and reliable drinking water, as well as an environment that helps sustain this reality, as first nations have enjoyed and protected from time immemorial, requires effective legislative tools. It is critical that we have effective legislation, a national regulatory regime and first nations-led institutions, so we can support sustainable access to clean, safe and reliable drinking water in first nations communities in perpetuity. That is why we introduced Bill C-61 today, which is a key commitment to establishing new proposed safe drinking water and waste water legislation in consultation with first nations. I really want to highlight that last piece; consultation is critical. The proposed legislation is aligned with the United Nations Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples. It was developed through engagement that put first nations' voices at the forefront. Our government worked directly with first nations rights holders, including modern treaty and self-governing first nations, through their own representative institutions, and first nations organizations, including the Assembly of First Nations and the first nations advisory committee on safe drinking water, to help ensure that the bill is responsive to first nations' needs and priorities. I want to thank everyone who has been a part of this process and helped strengthen this bill. Engagement leading to this bill began in 2018. Consultation drafts were posted online in the spirit of partnership, and we have encouraged feedback from as many first nations as possible. This consultation process is ongoing, and I think that is important. We want to hear from all voices across this country, and we hope that everyone will have the chance to be heard. This is what partnership looks like. Hand in hand, we will continue to grow and learn from each other, and we can certainly improve and do better at every turn. The days of paternalistic, one-sided and ineffective policy that ignores indigenous voices are gone, and we must ensure that they stay gone. The result is new proposed legislation that would affirm the inherent right of first nations to self-government. Bill C-61 would ensure that first nations have the tools necessary to protect source water and maintain drinking water and waste water infrastructure in a self-determined way. It is important to understand that this proposed legislation would hold the federal government accountable for investing in water infrastructure. It would also lead to the application of minimum standards for clean drinking water in every first nation across the country. It would lay the groundwork for the creation of a first nation-led water institution to support communities. Specifically, the bill would achieve a few things. It would require the Minister of Indigenous Services to make best efforts, in consultation and co-operation with first nations, to provide access to safe drinking water on first nations lands. It would strengthen funding commitments through best efforts to provide adequate and sustainable funding for water services on first nation lands, equitable to the services received in non-first nation communities. It would require that funding, at a minimum, meets the commitment of expenditures set out in the 2021 safe drinking water for first nations class action settlement agreement and establish minimum national standards for drinking water and waste water on first nations lands based on first nations' choice. It would facilitate water agreements, including transboundary source water protection agreements, which should involve first nations, Canada and provincial and territorial governments, as well as bilateral financial agreements between first nations and Canada to support the exercise of first nations jurisdiction. It would commit to supporting the establishment of a first nations water commission to assist first nations in exercising greater control over their drinking water and waste-water services, as well as the implementation of the United Nations Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples, including through consultation and co-operation on federal regulatory and funding allocation decisions. To those listening at home, this is huge. It is incredibly transformative, and I really cannot underscore that enough. I want to be clear: The government's commitment to sustainable access to safe and clean drinking water on first nations communities does not end with the introduction of this bill. We will continue to work with first nations rights holders and organizations to ensure access to safe drinking water, now and for future generations, so that no one else has to grow up without being able to brush their teeth, bathe at home or cook their food in the water that surrounds their community. I would also like to acknowledge the Auditor General's third report, titled “Access to Safe Drinking Water in First Nations Communities”. This report provided important recommendations for us to consider, and I want to thank the Auditor General once again for her work. We are working hard to do better for first nations communities. Previous governments of all stripes could not say this. It is the reason I ran to be involved in federal politics: I needed to see a change. The government has made historic investments to help first nations communities meet their needs. I am proud of this work, of this team and of our commitment to keep going. Recognizing that it is not a perfect path forward, we are committed to doing it in partnership with indigenous communities and leadership. When it comes to water and waste water, as of September 30, more than $3.6 billion of targeted funding has been invested to support 1,244 water and waste-water projects. Of these, 547 are now complete, while 697 are ongoing. These projects will serve 471,000 people in 591 first nations communities. We know these investments must continue. The fall economic statement announced in November included a renewal of $1.55 billion from 2024-25 to 2025-26 to support clean drinking water for first nations. This funding will ensure that water and waste-water projects continue without interruption. We heard from first nations leaders. They need strong, ambitious, sustainable and predictable investments. That is what is required, and that is what is being delivered. These investments are directly improving the everyday lives of first nations communities. We are making progress every day, and it is important to acknowledge these efforts while also acknowledging the need to go farther. Since 2015, first nations, with support from Indigenous Services Canada, have lifted 143 long-term drinking water advisories; 267 short-term drinking water advisories have been prevented from becoming long term. Comprehensive action plans are in place in 26 communities to resolve the 28 active long-term advisories. One long-term boil water advisory is one too many. We have a team on each project working at pace and in partnership with communities. This country will no longer dictate terms to first nations on how to achieve their goals; instead, we are extending a hand and letting the leadership shine and carry these remaining communities forward. We understand that many of these projects come with complex challenges, such as procuring resources, especially in remote communities, and extreme weather conditions that continue to affect infrastructure projects across the country. The solutions to address the lack of access to safe drinking water are unique to each first nation community. This is not a one-size-fits-all approach. Plans have been developed for each community, and we are currently working with them at different stages of these plans to improve infrastructure and operations. Ultimately, we understand and acknowledge that there is no one solution to this complex issue, but despite the complexity, there are many examples of positive results and innovation being led by first nations. I think we need a bit of hope at this time. Through my visits to communities, I have been fortunate to see some of these results and to meet with many leaders about the important work they are doing and the ways we can support them. For example, this June, Northwest Angle No. 33 in Ontario lifted three long-term drinking water advisories by leading the construction of a new centralized water treatment plant, replacing the outdated pump houses. Another example is the Okanagan Indian Band, where community leaders used an integrated project delivery approach to harness the talents of all participants and ensure accountability in environmental stewardship. The result was improved access to clean water and faster project delivery. One of the most critical areas of our work is to define a new approach to how the department funds on-reserve infrastructure and to return decision-making to where it belongs: with first nations communities. Over the next year, Indigenous Services Canada will continue to work on this important issue with first nations communities and organizations, other government departments and financial institutions. Above all, we are focused on service transfer in partnership with indigenous peoples. Service transfer is the basis of our work on access to safe drinking water, and it is critical to supporting indigenous self-determination. We share the goal of supporting sustainable first nations-led approaches to ensure that on-reserve water systems are safe. It is critical that first nations communities have the tools to decide for themselves, and I am honoured to work alongside them as we do this work for the next generations. Woliwon.

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Hon. Karina Gould (Leader of the Government in the House of Commons, Lib.)

Dec/11/23 7:02:01 p.m.
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moved: That this committee take note of Indigenous services.

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Mr. Gary Vidal (Desnethé—Missinippi—Churchill River, CPC)

Dec/11/23 7:12:31 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, the parliamentary secretary and I work together on the INAN committee and have had a good history of working together. The parliamentary secretary spent much of her time tonight talking about the water legislation, and I get that it is an exciting announcement for the government, but with the introduction of this legislation there has been a lot of talk about co-development, the idea of engaging with first nations across the country. To be honest, in my engagement with people last week who were in Ottawa for the Assembly of First Nations, all of the people I talked to say they are not sure who this co-development was with because it was not with their communities. Today, the FSIN, which represents 74 first nations in Saskatchewan, said the bill completely misses the mark. Chief Bobby Cameron said in a release, “As it stands, the federal water act announced today is not true reconciliation, it is an attempt to legalize the status quo.” I would ask the parliamentary secretary to explain to us who exactly the co-development was with, who they talked to, which first nations across the country they communicated and engaged with on the development of this legislation, because nobody I have talked to was part of that process. If she could answer that, I would appreciate it.

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Mrs. Jenica Atwin

Dec/11/23 7:13:57 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, as I mentioned, consultation is critical. We are really trying to redesign this approach and make sure we are moving forward hand in hand in partnership. I know that it is five years since the consultation process began in 2018. Draft legislation was shared with every first nations community in this country at least twice. We heard from indigenous partners. At the announcement this morning, they were able to share some of that process and the idea of getting as close to co-development as we can get. It is a process we need to ensure moves forward in other departments as well. I would like to see it improved. It is also important that any voices who have concerns know that the process is still continuing. We still have the committee process and debate in this House. We want to make sure everyone has the opportunity to be part of this and be proud of what we are moving forward with. I would challenge the idea that it is the status quo. I really think this is transformative. It is changing lives and we will see this, hopefully, in perpetuity because this legislation really enshrines it to ensure that it continues regardless of what government is in power. Consultation is key, and I appreciate the member highlighting that.

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Mr. Blake Desjarlais (Edmonton Griesbach, NDP)

Dec/11/23 7:15:07 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, specific to the member's statement about the water legislation, it is clear from speaking with members of Treaty Nos. 6, 7 and 8 across the Prairies and, in particular, in my home province of Alberta, that they are concerned about the consultation process. The government has a very important principle that it must honour, which is the honour of the Crown. It is to do things to better the relationship with the nations with which they have signed treaties. Those same nations are today saying that they have not been spoken to. Four times Treaty Nos. 6, 7 and 8 reached out to the Minister of Indigenous Services and failed to get a response. When will the minister take the rights of treaty people seriously and consult, with the true honour of the Crown? It must be acknowledged by these nations. The continued failure to do so is a failure on the part of Canada and on the part of the minister. What does the government have to say to treaty nations that feel right now that the government is taking steps to stomp on the rights of treaty people across our country? What will it do to ensure that the consultation process is more robust and clear, but, more importantly, respects their rights? To date, they are telling us it does not.

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Mrs. Jenica Atwin

Dec/11/23 7:16:23 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, I thoroughly respect my colleague. It is an important question for all of us to discuss in this House. What does true consultation look like? What does true partnership look like? We know that every indigenous community in the country was given this draft legislation on two different occasions. I know it was first released in May. There was also the online consultation period. It is disheartening to hear that they had an issue communicating with the minister. I will certainly bring that back to the department and make sure we have open lines of communication. I am also happy, as the parliamentary secretary, to sit down with these communities and have these discussions. Ideally, this is supposed to be done before we introduce legislation, so we really need to look at this process moving forward. It is absolutely about respecting the treaties. This is one of the reasons I came to this House: to ensure the treaties are recognized and upheld. I come from a peace and friendship territory on the east coast, which is unceded, unsurrendered territory, and this is what we talk about all the time. The number one thing we can do in this country to walk in reconciliation is uphold the treaties. We did hear from Treaty No. 5 territory partners, who are happy with this. There are some issues as well about ensuring that all voices are heard. The Assembly of First Nations is largely supportive of this as well. The Atlantic First Nations Water Authority, which is first nations-led, from my neck of the woods is also very supportive and spoke at the press conference today. It is important and we will receive the criticisms, but I am going to look forward in a really positive way because this is transformative and speaks to challenging the status quo. Every department can look into what they can do to better that consultation process.

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Mr. Garnett Genuis (Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, CPC)

Dec/11/23 7:17:54 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, I want to ask the government a bit of a broader question. The member spoke about including the voices of indigenous peoples, consultation, self-government, etc. However, I note that in many cases there is a tension between the government's stated goals with respect to climate policy and what individual indigenous nations may be asking for. There is a case now that has over 130 indigenous nations taking the government to court over its carbon tax policy. I have heard from indigenous communities, for instance in the north, that there was a complete lack of consultation before the government imposed development bans. We heard on a foreign affairs committee trip a number of years ago to the Northwest Territories that the consultation before imposing the development moratorium was a phone call 45 minutes before an announcement was made. Therefore, it seems that the government has a bit of a problem in cases where indigenous peoples are calling for policies that contradict the government's stated goals when it comes to its so-called climate policy. In instances where there is a conflict, what should win out? Should it be the government's intentions with regard to a carbon tax or blocking development; or should it be the wishes of indigenous people?

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Mrs. Jenica Atwin

Dec/11/23 7:19:09 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, it is important that all members of this House try not to use indigenous people as a pawn in their political games or their partisan ideology. What we are seeing playing out with this conversation right now is a misrepresentation of what is happening. Indigenous peoples are on the front line of what is happening with the climate crisis and they really want us to act. I know that, in most cases among the leadership I have spoken to, there is a consensus that pricing mechanisms can get us further on reducing our greenhouse gas emissions and indigenous peoples want to be partners with that. The conversation that is happening around Ontario chiefs is important. It is really about their wanting a more equitable stake in what is happening around our approach to the environment, so we are going to have that conversation. I really look forward to the judicial review and what comes out of that, but, again, it is important to deal in facts and it is really important to acknowledge that indigenous peoples are there with us, wanting to confront this climate crisis head-on.

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Mr. Gord Johns (Courtenay—Alberni, NDP)

Dec/11/23 7:20:09 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, over the last 20 years, Indigenous Services Canada has cut tribal council funding in half. This is under both the Harper Conservative government and the current government. These severe cutbacks have had a huge impact on critical services to the nations in my riding. The Nuu-chah-nulth Tribal Council and AFN have been asking for increases in funding via motions, letters and meetings. They have been literally begging for the government to increase funding. This is impacting children, youth and elders in our communities. When does Indigenous Services Canada intend to finally increase tribal council funding and bring it back to the level it was 20 years ago?

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Mrs. Jenica Atwin

Dec/11/23 7:21:02 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, we know we need stable, predictable, ongoing funding so that communities can provide the services that they need. We know that it affects children. We know that it affects operations. I know that, in general, Indigenous Services Canada's funding has increased by 156% since 2015. I would love to look specifically into this piece around the tribal council funding. Again, it is incumbent upon all of us. We have the 2024 budget ahead. I will need help in asking for this increase. It is going to take all of us to ensure that this is a priority for our government. I hear the member on this. I am also concerned. I would specifically, again, like to look into it and I will get back to the member with that information.

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Mr. John Aldag (Cloverdale—Langley City, Lib.)

Dec/11/23 7:21:51 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, I would like to direct the question to the parliamentary secretary related to how this work helps with reconciliation. Many Canadians follow the relationship between Canada and the indigenous peoples. We have disappointed this relationship time and time again, as the Crown. The residential school legacy that has generational impacts and the fact that many indigenous persons have not had adequate water for generations are inexcusable, but reconciliation has to start somewhere. Could my colleague reflect on how this is one small step forward in the work that needs to happen? I have heard from first nations communities in particular that our government has done more than any government, probably since Confederation, in moving forward reconciliation. How is this one more piece of that healing path that we need to be on as a Canadian society with the indigenous peoples in Canada?

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Mrs. Jenica Atwin

Dec/11/23 7:22:51 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, I think about water in particular as being so critical to this conversation around reconciliation. It is about the environment. It is about stewardship but water is life. My stepfather is a Wolastoq Grand Council chief and his main priority is protecting the water and that is what I have been taught to do from a young age. For me, this is huge. I had tears in my eyes this morning, in taking part in the press conference. I think we can all be proud of what was accomplished today.

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