SoVote

Context: House Hansard - 316 - May/23/24

May/23/24 9:04:02 p.m.
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Madam Chair, the condescending tone from the minister, just because I have not been here for very long, does not mean that I do not know what I am talking about. In fact, with these cases in mind, I would like to know if the justice minister is willing to humbly acknowledge that Liberal bail policies are enabling repeat offenders to commit more crimes.

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Hon. Arif Virani

May/23/24 9:04:31 p.m.
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Re: Bill C-48

Madam Chair, again, for his edification, I would point the member toward Bill C-48, which may have been passed before he arrived. It talked about serious, violent, repeat offenders being subjected to a reverse onus, so instead of being presumed to receive bail, they are presumed not to receive bail and have to convince a justice of the peace otherwise.

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The Deputy Chair

May/23/24 9:04:50 p.m.
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Order. I have a point of order from the hon. deputy government House leader.

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Deputy

Mr. Mark Gerretsen

May/23/24 9:05:00 p.m.
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Madam Chair, on this side of the House we are being very quiet and letting the questions be answered, yet the minister is continually being heckled when he is trying to provide answers. Perhaps you could encourage the members on the other side, including the former Speaker of the House of Commons, to use better judgment and instead of lashing out, listen to what the minister has to say. An hon. member: If anyone knows—

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The Deputy Chair

May/23/24 9:05:24 p.m.
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Order. I have already raised this point on a number of occasions. The hon. members lose time every time I have to call a point of order. I would ask members to please be respectful. If they wish to add something, they can get up and speak at their appropriate time. The hon. member for Durham.

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Durham

Mr. Jamil Jivani

May/23/24 9:05:40 p.m.
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Madam Chair, on numerous occasions the justice minister has made reference to me as the newest MP here. His government has been in power for nine years, and in those nine years, people's lives have gotten harder, criminals have been allowed to get in and out of courthouses like a turnstile and the minister is continuously putting communities at risk. You have had nine years, and look at what has happened.

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The Deputy Chair

May/23/24 9:06:10 p.m.
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The hon. member knows full well that he is to address all questions and comments through the Chair. The hon. minister.

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Hon. Arif Virani

May/23/24 9:06:26 p.m.
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Madam Chair, I would indicate to the member opposite that persons who are released on bail through an independent decision made by a justice of the peace in Ontario are often subject to conditions of release that are tailored to their specific situation. Always, the key concerns are deterring a repeat offence, ensuring that we are sending a message, and ensuring that there is not a flight risk.

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Mr. Jamil Jivani

May/23/24 9:06:49 p.m.
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Madam Chair, the justice minister clearly needs to humble himself, admit the Liberal government's mistakes, stop allowing repeat offenders back on the street, and actually keep our neighbourhoods and our communities safe.

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Hon. Arif Virani

May/23/24 9:07:07 p.m.
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Madam Chair, I would reiterate for the member's edification that I do not make individual bail decisions in a country like ours and in a democracy like ours. Those are made by justices of the peace or judges around the country. An hon. member: Oh, oh!

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The Deputy Chair

May/23/24 9:07:17 p.m.
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The hon. member had opportunities to ask questions. He should wait for the answer and not interrupt. Resuming debate, the hon. Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Transport.

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Secretary

Mr. Vance Badawey (Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Transport, Lib.)

May/23/24 9:07:27 p.m.
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Re: Bill C-69

Madam Chair, I appreciate the opportunity this evening to speak on an issue of major concern to the residents of Canada: the threats of organized crime and money laundering and the measures that the Government of Canada is taking to respond to these serious problems. Specifically, I am going to share with everyone how the government proposes to strengthen the robust framework that is in place in the Criminal Code to address these serious crimes. The government has been listening to the concerns of communities in Canada and is acting to ensure that law enforcement and prosecutors have the laws and tools they need to combat these serious crimes. Organized criminal groups are increasingly sophisticated and mobile. Their activities extend beyond the illegal drug trade to include the trafficking of human beings, cross-border smuggling, counterfeit goods, natural resource crimes and money laundering. As we have seen in recent years, organized crime has also expanded its focus to auto theft. Organized crime has devastating impacts on our health, safety and economic security. These impacts include the harms of substance use and the tragedy associated with overdose; the loss of financial security due to crimes such as auto theft and frauds; and the erosion of our communities' sense of safety and security. However, I am pleased to speak today about some of the considerable tools that police and prosecutors have to assist them in the investigation and prosecution of organized crime offences and money laundering. The Criminal Code defines a criminal organization broadly. It refers to “a group, however organized...of three or more persons in or outside Canada” that “has as one of its main purposes or main activities” to commit or facilitate a serious offence that would “result in...a material benefit” for anyone in the group. A serious offence is one that is punishable by at least five years' imprisonment or that is otherwise prescribed by regulation. As well, there are four specific criminal organization offences in the Criminal Code. These consist of participating in the activities of a criminal organization, recruiting members for a criminal organization, committing an indictable offence for a criminal organization and instructing the commission of an offence for a criminal organization. These offences are punishable by significant penalties, including up to life imprisonment for instructing the commission of an offence for a criminal organization. The involvement of organized crime in an offence has further implications under the Criminal Code, both prior to a trial and following a conviction. These include the availability of enhanced tools to enable police to investigate offences involving organized crime. They also include the requirement for a person charged with an offence involving organized crime to justify why their release from custody pending trial is, in fact, warranted. There are significant implications for an offender who is convicted of a criminal organization offence. They include that the courts must consider, as an aggravating factor for sentencing, that a crime was committed for the benefit of a criminal organization. All murders connected to an organized crime are automatically treated as first-degree murder, regardless of whether or not they were planned and deliberate. There are increased maximum and mandatory minimum penalties of imprisonment for certain offences committed in connection with organized crime, and the offender may face forfeiture of the proceeds of their crime unless they can demonstrate that the property was not obtained or derived from organized crime activity. Although the Criminal Code has a comprehensive framework to address organized crime in all its forms, the government has in recent months considered how best to update our criminal law as organized crime shifts its strategies. That is why I am pleased to outline the measures included in Bill C-69, the budget implementation act. To respond to the rise in motor vehicle theft, particularly where violence and organized crime are involved, the proposed amendments include the following: new offences targeting auto theft and its links to violence and organized crime, which would carry a maximum penalty of 14 years of imprisonment; new offences for possession and distribution of a device suitable for committing auto theft, which would carry a maximum penalty of 10 years of imprisonment; a new aggravating factor at sentencing if an offender involved a young person in committing a crime; and, lastly, a new offence for laundering proceeds of crime for the benefit of a criminal organization, which would carry a maximum penalty of 14 years of imprisonment. However, this is not all the government has been doing to provide law enforcement and prosecutors with tools in the Criminal Code to respond to the serious crimes of money laundering and terrorist financing. In recent years, the Government of Canada has introduced legislative reforms to the Proceeds of Crime (Money Laundering) and Terrorist Financing Act, the Income Tax Act and the Criminal Code to better respond to money laundering and terrorist financing. Having said all that, I have a question for the minister with respect to the notwithstanding clause. We have often heard from the leader of the new Reform Party across the way about the notwithstanding clause. However, zero is the number of times that any federal government from any party has ever used the notwithstanding clause, as this would negate enshrined freedoms of Canadians. Furthermore, it has only rarely been used by provinces. However, two weeks ago, the Leader of the Opposition, the new Reform Party, said that he would trample on our charter and use the notwithstanding clause to knowingly violate Canadians' rights. This is very serious. Can the Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada talk to this chamber about the notwithstanding clause and why it should not be used to attack the rights and freedoms of Canadians as proposed by the Leader of the Opposition, the new Reform Party?

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Hon. Arif Virani (Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada, Lib.)

May/23/24 9:15:03 p.m.
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Madam Chair, I want to make two clarifications. The study on the Canadian Victims Bill of Rights generated a report from the committee on December 7 of last year. In addition, what the member for Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo was asking was quite troubling, because the notion that a sitting attorney general would appear in live court during the middle of a criminal proceeding would, in my view, raise a very significant concern about undue influence and possibly efforts to influence the outcome of a proceeding. That would be entirely untoward and inappropriate. With respect to the question presented by the member for Niagara, what is troubling about even floating the idea of invocation of the notwithstanding clause is that it presents a spectre where the charter and the rights and freedoms contained therein are an inconvenience that needs to be overcome. The fact that they would be cavalierly overcome by a man who is the leader of the official opposition, who would purportedly claim the role of prime minister one day, is very troubling. It would set a precedent, as it has never been done in the history of this country. It would also demonstrate a real disregard for the important interests that Canadians have in the Charter of Rights and Freedoms itself. Why do I say that? It is because the charter protects fundamental things, such as the free expressive rights that we have been talking about in the context of the online safety bill, which are protected under section 2B; freedom of religion, which is so preciously at stake right now when we are dealing with so much troubling anti-Semitism; the ability to peacefully assemble, which is protected under section 2 of the charter; and our rights to equality and our rights to basic presumptions of innocence. If the Leader of the Opposition would so cavalierly use the notwithstanding clause to trump basic presumptions about innocence, it raises a lot of questions for Canadians, including those who are watching right now: In what other ways would he use it? Section 7 protects a woman's right to have an abortion in this country. Section 15 protects such things as equality rights in terms of gay marriage. Would he use it in those regards? I do not know the answer to these questions. However, as Minister of Justice and as guardian of the Constitution and the rights and freedoms contained therein, I am very troubled. Our position as a government, our position as a party, is clear. We created the Charter of Rights and Freedoms, and we stand by it; that means every right and freedom contained therein. Canadians need to know what we stand for and what the official opposition stands for.

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Mr. Vance Badawey

May/23/24 9:17:32 p.m.
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Re: Bill C-40

Madam Chair, one of the limits on access to justice is that many people do not know that there is a wrongful convictions review process in the first place. Often they do not have the resources to apply in the current process. Can the minister please discuss the proactive outreach measures in Bill C-40 to help ensure that those in need can in fact apply?

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Hon. Arif Virani

May/23/24 9:18:02 p.m.
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Re: Bill C-40

Mr. Speaker, Bill C-40 represents a staggering change in the way we envisage wrongful convictions in this country. It would provide a new mechanism, a review commission, which would have the tools and resources to go out and find the cases. In the same time period, in the U.K., within a 20-year time frame, about 500 cases were unearthed that dealt with wrongful convictions. In the same time period in Canada, 27 cases were found. I know the member to be a strong advocate of the indigenous community in this country. Among those 27 cases in Canada, five involved Black or indigenous men. Given the severe overrepresentation of Black and indigenous people in our justice system, that is a completely disproportionate statistic that is statistically improbable. Does it mean that, in the U.K., they are wrongfully convicting more people than we are in Canada? No, I think it means that we are not finding the cases here in Canada. The bill, unfortunately, was obstructed at the justice committee, but it has now finally left the justice committee. Through it, we have the ability to make a fundamental change in how we deal with wrongful convictions in this country, providing the resources and the outreach capability to find the cases and bring innocent men and women to justice in this country, something that is long overdue.

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Mr. Vance Badawey

May/23/24 9:19:07 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, as members of Parliament, we were all elected by Canadians with the duty to improve their lives and make Canada a better and safer place. The issue of auto theft should not be partisan; at the end of the day, we are all here with a genuine wish to bring these crimes to an end. One way to do this is through collaboration. As we have seen, the federal government stood on Monday alongside police forces and municipalities. Can the minister share with us his thoughts on the importance of cross-partisan collaboration, in order to put an end to auto theft crimes?

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Hon. Arif Virani

May/23/24 9:19:50 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I absolutely can. I will say that cross-party collaboration is happening, at least, between the federal and the provincial governments, with my counterparts in Ontario and Quebec, where I have a strong collaborative relationship with Attorney General Doug Downey. What we have said is that we need to be working together. That is why we are investing in law enforcement, which assists the province. That is why we are making changes to the Criminal Code. What are those changes? We are introducing an aggravating factor where, if an adult organized criminal is using a child or an adolescent, we will ensure that they are subject to a tougher penalty. We are ensuring that if one does a carjacking, a violent car theft in broad daylight, one is subject to a tougher penalty of up to 14 years. If there are threats of violence or the involvement of organized criminality, that will trigger differential penalties. In addition, the possession and distribution of the device that is used, the key fob theft devices, etc., will trigger additional penalties. These points are critical for tackling the pressing issue of auto theft. They have been welcomed by the law enforcement community and partisan people of every political stripe around this country at multiple levels. The only people who do not seem to be welcoming and embracing these changes are those in the official opposition, and it leads me to wonder why.

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Mr. Vance Badawey

May/23/24 9:21:01 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, this is something that I have been hearing a lot about, especially of late, in particular as it relates to some of the agendas, mostly political. With that, certain individuals seem to be fanning the flames of hate to further their own agendas. Hate is on the rise in Canada. It is alarming and distressing to hear numerous accounts of hatred against people in our public forum, for example. This includes a rise in both anti-Semitism and Islamophobia. Hatred has no place in this country, in Canada. All people must feel safe to express themselves, whether it be online or off-line. Can the Minister of Justice please discuss how the online harms act would help keep us safe from hatred?

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Hon. Arif Virani

May/23/24 9:21:57 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, it would do so by entrenching a definition of hatred that has already been upheld by the Supreme Court of Canada; by ensuring that hatred is identified and one's exposure to it is reduced via putting a responsibility on platforms; by ensuring that one can complain to the Canadian Human Rights Commission if one believes that one is the target of online hate speech; and by ensuring that the penalties for hatred, including the anti-Semitism and Islamophobia that were just mentioned by the member, are addressed with more significant penalties on summary conviction and on indictable offences. We have a scourge of hatred in this country, and we have to address it. That is what the bill would do.

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Mr. Michael Cooper (St. Albert—Edmonton, CPC)

May/23/24 9:22:33 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I will be splitting my time three ways, with the hon. member for Louis-Saint-Laurent, followed by the member for Langley—Aldergrove. The RCMP carried out a criminal investigation into whether the Prime Minister obstructed justice when he fired Jody Wilson-Raybould as his attorney general during the SNC-Lavalin scandal. At committee, the RCMP confirmed that this investigation was thwarted after the Prime Minister hid behind cabinet confidence, refusing to turn over documents that were requested by the RCMP. Can the minister confirm whether the Prime Minister will finally end the obstruction and turn over the documents so that the RCMP can complete its investigation?

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