SoVote

Decentralized Democracy

Ontario Assembly

43rd Parl. 1st Sess.
May 17, 2023 09:00AM
  • May/17/23 3:20:00 p.m.

This petition is entitled “Protect the Greenbelt: Repeal Bill 23.” I want to thank the people from Kitchener and Elmira for collecting the signatures.

“To the Legislative Assembly of Ontario:

“Whereas Bill 23 will remove protected land from the greenbelt, allowing wealthy developers to profit by bulldozing over 7,000 acres of farmland;

“Whereas green spaces and farmland are what we rely on to grow food, support natural habitats, prevent flooding, and mitigate future climate disasters;

“Whereas Ontario loses” 319 “acres of farmland daily to development;

“Whereas the government’s Housing Affordability Task Force found there are plenty of places to build homes without destroying the greenbelt, showcasing that Bill 23 was never about housing but about making the rich richer;

“Whereas the power of conservation authorities will be taken away, weakening environmental protections, and preventing future development;

“Therefore we, the undersigned, petition the Legislative Assembly of Ontario to immediately repeal Bill 23, stop all plans to further remove protected land from the greenbelt....”

I fully support this petition, will affix my signature and give it to page Leonard.

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  • May/17/23 3:20:00 p.m.

J’aimerais remercier Andréane Chénier de Hanmer dans mon comté pour cette pétition.

« Soutenez le système d’éducation francophone en Ontario...

« Attendu que les enfants francophones ont un droit constitutionnel à une éducation de haute qualité, financée par les fonds publics, dans leur ... langue;

« Attendu que l’augmentation des inscriptions dans le système d’éducation en langue française signifie que plus de 1 000 nouveaux enseignants et enseignantes de langue française sont nécessaires chaque année pour les cinq prochaines années;

« Attendu que les changements apportés au modèle de financement du gouvernement provincial pour la formation des enseignantes et enseignants de langue française signifient que l’Ontario n’en forme que 500 par an;

« Attendu que le nombre de personnes qui enseignent sans certification complète dans le système d’éducation en langue française a augmenté de plus de 450 % au cours de la dernière décennie; »

Ils et elles demandent à l’Assemblée législative de l’Ontario « de fournir immédiatement le financement demandé » dans « le rapport du groupe de travail sur la pénurie des enseignantes et des enseignants dans le système d’éducation en langue française ... et de travailler avec des partenaires pour mettre pleinement en oeuvre » ces « recommandations. »

J’appuie cette pétition, monsieur le Président. J’affixe mon nom et je demande à Dominic de l’amener à la table des greffiers.

Resuming the debate adjourned on May 17, 2023, on the motion for third reading of the following bill:

Bill 85, An Act to implement Budget measures and to amend various statutes / Projet de loi 85, Loi visant à mettre en oeuvre les mesures budgétaires et à modifier diverses lois.

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  • May/17/23 3:20:00 p.m.
  • Re: Bill 85 

I rise today in support of the Building a Strong Ontario Act and to speak to our government’s plan to navigate these uncertain times and help people and businesses.

I want to talk to you today about something that affects my constituents of Carleton: economic uncertainty. My constituents, every day, are facing the cost-of-living pressures due to high inflation, interest rates and supply chain disruptions. Understandably, families, workers and businesses in Carleton are feeling the pinch and looking to the government for help. And that’s precisely what we’re doing.

We’ve developed a plan called Building a Strong Ontario that’s responsible, targeted and designed to help people and businesses today while creating a solid fiscal foundation for future generations. And the good news is that this plan is already showing results. Our population is growing, jobs are being created, and we’re attracting manufacturing investments. In fact, Ontario’s population has surpassed 15 million people, with 275,000 more people moving here yearly. This growth is helping to strengthen my riding of Carleton, and that benefits families, workers, businesses and public services. And it’s allowing all of Ontario to remain resilient during economic uncertainty. Our plan is focused on building up and investing in Ontario’s economy for the future with the infrastructure needed to support growth across the province.

Our government is training workers for future jobs, keeping costs down today, and providing better services for the people of Ontario and their families. One example of this in my riding is the investment in hospice care, with over $3 million going towards the Ronald McDonald House in Ottawa. This expansion will more than double the capacity of Ronald McDonald House from 55,000 stays to 115,000 overnight stays per year for families with children being treated at the Children’s Hospital of Eastern Ontario.

And as a part of our effort to establish a more interconnected and convenient health care system, we have undertaken an exceedingly ambitious initiative for hospital expansion in Ontario. Over the next decade, we will invest more than $48 billion in hospital infrastructure, which encompasses over $32 billion in hospital capital grants.

Notably, the Queensway Carleton Hospital mental health redevelopment project already achieved significant milestones, including the completion of construction in December 2022. This development incorporates two additional acute mental health beds and an expansion of mental health and addiction programs and services. This was much needed. I recall visiting the centre and doing a tour and speaking with those front-line health care workers who were providing services to patients in that facility, and this is welcome news for them. The remaining renovations are expected to be finalized by November 2023, leading to positive outcomes for my constituents in Carleton and the entire Ottawa and eastern Ontario region.

I am pleased to discuss our province’s commitment to improving Ontario’s transportation infrastructure. Our government has pledged $27.9 billion over the next decade to enhance connectivity, reduce traffic congestion and facilitate the movement of goods and people throughout the province. Through the Ontario highways program, over 600 expansion and renovation initiatives are either currently under way or are slated for completion within the next four years. Additionally, we are widening existing highways to boost capacity and enhance traveller safety.

Madam Speaker, I’m particularly thrilled about the ongoing and future projects that will benefit the residents of Carleton. Recently, the rehabilitation and replacement of bridges at Innes Road and Ramsayville Road were completed as part of the Highway 417 project in Ottawa. Furthermore, we’re committed to finishing the widening of a 22.5-kilometre stretch of Highway 17 from Arnprior to Renfrew, which will be a significant boon to both Ottawa and eastern Ontario.

It’s a well-known fact that small businesses and entrepreneurs are the driving force of our province. For this reason, our government is backing regional innovation centre hubs. These hubs play a crucial role in aiding entrepreneurship by working with other regional innovation centres and organizers to provide entrepreneurs with the necessary resources to launch and sustain their businesses. Our government is committed to supporting small business owners and entrepreneurs, and this budget demonstrates that commitment.

All of these investments in my riding of Carleton and across the Ottawa region mean more well-paying jobs, and more well-paying jobs grow our economy. But don’t take my word for it, Madam Speaker; just listen to what the president and CEO of Invest Ottawa, Michael Tremblay, said about the government’s proposed budget:

“This government budget firmly secures the key role we play in our community and Ontario, enabling us to serve more high-growth entrepreneurs and companies that fuel our economy. It will help us to achieve an even greater economic impact and ensure that innovative businesses in Ottawa continue to grow and succeed today and for years to come. We are very grateful to the government of Ontario for this critical investment in our community.”

Christine Hardy, the CEO of the Ronald McDonald House Charities Ottawa, has said, “Receiving this incredible $3.1 million grant from the government of Ontario will enable our Ronald McDonald House in Ottawa to officially break ground this year and get started on a much-needed expansion of 22 more bedrooms. We have been operating since 1984 with just 14 bedrooms, we are always at full capacity, and desperately need to grow to reflect the diverse needs of the communities we serve and to reduce our wait-list. When families stay at the house it is because their child is receiving urgent critical medical care far from home, often for months and in some cases years at a time. It is my honour to speak on behalf of all Ronald McDonald House Ottawa-region families with sick children when I say thank you—having this kind of recognition from the government of Ontario is truly helping us make room for all families.”

Madam Speaker, I’ve had the honour and the privilege of visiting the Ronald McDonald House in Ottawa twice. The most recent time was just this past year. I spoke with Christine Hardy, and this is one of the things we spoke about. To see our government taking this feedback, to see our government listening to local MPPs—when I do these tours and I go back to the Premier and the ministers and I say, “This is what the community needs in the Ottawa area,” for this $3.1-million investment in Ronald McDonald House in Ottawa to be specifically in the budget is a testament to our government’s commitment to serving the people of Ontario.

Christine Hardy said thank you to our government. Madam Speaker, I also say thank you to our government for finally listening to the needs of the people of Ottawa and the people in eastern Ontario.

Madam Speaker, as we continue to grow our economy and create more jobs, we have to tackle the labour shortage that’s facing every community in Ontario, including in my riding of Carleton. In order to develop a strong workforce that can meet the demands of today and tomorrow’s job market, our government is investing significant resources. We’ll be investing an additional $75 million over the next three years in our Skills Development Fund. Additionally, we’re allocating an extra $224 million to expand training centres and leverage private sector expertise, including union-led training halls. This will allow us to train and retain skilled workers in high-demand fields.

Madam Speaker, I see my time is running short, so I just want to end my speech by saying that I’m pleased to support our government’s budget. I urge all members to join me in getting it done for the people of Ontario. The people of Ontario will always be able to rely on this government and this Premier to have their backs, and we will continue to do so, because that’s why they voted for us, that’s what they count on us for, and that’s what we will continue to do.

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  • May/17/23 3:20:00 p.m.

“To the Legislative Assembly of Ontario:

“Whereas the process popularly known as declawing is actually an amputation, that is the equivalent of cutting off a human’s fingers from the knuckle up;

“Whereas the Canadian Veterinary Medical Association considers declawing to be an unnecessary cosmetic procedure;

“Whereas research has shown that declawing a cat significantly reduces a cat’s quality of life and leads to behavioural and health problems;

“Whereas declawing eliminates a cat’s ability defend itself when in danger; and

“Whereas the process is considered to be inhumane and is banned in more than 40 countries;

“We, the undersigned, petition the Legislative Assembly of Ontario as follows:

“To ban the unnecessary and inhumane procedure known as declawing in the province of Ontario.”

I will affix my signature to this and give it to Claire to bring to the table.

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  • May/17/23 3:30:00 p.m.
  • Re: Bill 85 

Thank you to the member from Carleton for her presentation. I really appreciate how you speak with people in your community and the feedback that you are receiving from your community members.

As you know, the Minister of Finance has mentioned, or told this House about, our 2023 budget, which strikes the right balance. We know that education and health care are the biggest, how shall we say—that’s where most of our funding goes, to both health care and education. My question to the member is, why is it so important to invest in these two areas, and what feedback have you received from your community members, maybe on the increase in the mental health spending that we’re doing?

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  • May/17/23 3:30:00 p.m.
  • Re: Bill 85 

Madam Speaker, through you, I would like to thank the member for his question.

To ensure that more seniors who need financial help receive it, our government is proposing to make changes to expand the eligibility for GAINS, which is the Guaranteed Annual Income System for seniors. Starting in July 2024, it would see about 100,000 more low-income seniors receive payment, with a 50% increase in recipients.

Madam Speaker, we’re also building more long-term-care beds, and we’re also making sure that seniors are protected at home. For example, we’re investing in community paramedicine: more than $174 million over two years, starting in 2024-25, to continue the Community Paramedicine for Long-Term Care Program.

Our government is investing in seniors, and we will continue to support those people who helped us to build Ontario.

You know, Madam Speaker, when I think about public education, I think about my story My parents immigrated to Canada when I was a year old. They came here to escape a fascist dictatorship, and they came to Canada because they wanted to have an opportunity to raise their one-year-old daughter in a free and democratic society. When they came to Canada, they had two suitcases, $50 in their pocket and a one-year-old daughter, me. Back in 1986, their first night in Canada, they had rented an apartment. The apartment was barren—it was empty, because they had just arrived—and so my dad tells me that their first night in Canada, they slept on newspapers and I was sleeping in my parents’ jackets.

Now, 37 years later, here I am, a politician in the provincial Legislature of Ontario, and that’s because of our public education system, Madam Speaker. I am a product of the public education system. That is why—

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  • May/17/23 3:30:00 p.m.
  • Re: Bill 85 

Thank you, Speaker, and thanks to the member from Carleton for her comments on the budget bill. I was taken aback a little bit by her comments around hospice, because Hospice Care Ottawa actually came to the budget committee and they asked the government, the Conservative government of Ontario, to address the unfair funding formula. They made a very compelling case, I would say, on the return on investment for investing in hospice to avoid people ending up in hospital or emergency care during the end stages of their lives. But they specifically said that the operational costs in hospices are only funded to 60%, so this leaves hospices fundraising for nurses, PSWs and grief counselling. And we heard loud and clear at finance committee how important it is.

Why did Bill 85 not address this crucial part of health care funding for a more compassionate and dignified end for Ontarians?

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  • May/17/23 3:30:00 p.m.
  • Re: Bill 85 

I’d like to thank the member from Carleton for her comments. I think we can all agree that the best place for seniors—the place where they are healthiest in body, mind and soul—is at home, when they are supported in their home.

Community support services presented during the pre-budget consultations for the 2023 budget and showed how early intervention is key and critical to make sure that people are healthiest at home. Presenters from community support services included such groups as Meals on Wheels. I also heard from Cheshire homes in my community, St. Joe’s hospice and the Alzheimer Society.

When seniors are cared for properly within the community, with community support services, it actually diverts costs and makes sure that people have the care that they need, because for someone to be supported at home, it costs $42; in long-term care, it’s $126; and in hospital, it’s $842.

My question to the member: Why do we not see increased investment in community support services for our seniors living at home?

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  • May/17/23 3:40:00 p.m.
  • Re: Bill 85 

Thank you to the member for Carleton for her comments. This budget does nothing substantial to address emergency rooms scaling back and closing across the province, while at the same time the government is spending hundreds of thousands of dollars in court to suppress health care workers’ wages. Does the member believe that this reflects the priorities of the people of Ontario?

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  • May/17/23 3:40:00 p.m.
  • Re: Bill 85 

I’m not sure why the member was taken aback by my comments, because the comments that I made came from an email that I received personally from Christine Hardy, the CEO of Ronald McDonald House in Ottawa. I’m just going to repeat the email that she sent. In her email, she said, “Receiving this incredible $3.1-million grant from the government of Ontario will enable our Ronald McDonald House in Ottawa to officially break ground this year and get started on a much-needed expansion of 22 more bedrooms.”

Madam Speaker, Ronald McDonald House has been seeking this expansion for years. They were ignored by the previous government, which was supported by the NDP, by the way. And it’s only under this government and this Premier that Ronald McDonald House in Ottawa finally got funding to expand and create more beds since they were created in 1984.

I also spoke about union halls and union learning centres. What comes to mind is the ironworkers located in Metcalfe, which I’ve had the pleasure of visiting several times, including with Minister McNaughton. This budget is going to help people who work and train at the ironworkers in Metcalfe and others all across my riding of Carleton, because skilled trades is such an important profession. As the daughter of a skilled trades worker, this is a testament to how we are supporting Ontario.

When that party, when the official opposition speaks about diversity and supporting immigrants, what did they do for immigrants like me and my family and my friends who came here with these health care degrees and were ignored by the Liberals for 15 years, which were supported by the NDP? It is our government that is actually supporting these health care workers trained in other countries to get the jobs that they are qualified to do here in Ontario. That is why I support this government and this budget, and I am proud to be a part of this government.

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  • May/17/23 3:40:00 p.m.
  • Re: Bill 85 

Thank you, Speaker, and through you to the member for Carleton: I’d like her to talk about the impact of the budget specifically on her riding and what those investments mean to her hard-working families in Carleton.

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  • May/17/23 3:40:00 p.m.
  • Re: Bill 85 

I rise to speak to Bill 85, and I want to thank the House for the opportunity to speak to this on behalf of the good people of Scarborough Southwest—to debate the budget bill.

As we heard in this House many, many times—and I know my colleague from Waterloo talks about it—budgets are about priorities, about the investments that we make to care for the people of our province, about the choices that prioritize the needs of the people.

This budget that is in question here, according to members opposite, is the biggest budget in the history of this province—and this is actually a quote from government members—the biggest spending, which seems like a great start, when you look at the current reality of so many people in our province.

I know my government colleagues will heckle me, so I’m ready for that. Go ahead.

I want to start off by saying what happened during the pre-budget consultation. Let me just read a quote from the pre-budget consultation, from economic affairs. This is what the Association of Municipal Managers, Clerks and Treasurers of Ontario and the Association of Municipalities Ontario, who have, all together, summarized and highlighted in this report—which is, a number of wit-nesses expressed uncertainty about the financial impact of the changes on municipal budgets. Some witnesses asked that the province ensure financial support for municipalities to mitigate potential negative outcomes. And they went on to talk about some of the needs.

We know that municipalities are dealing with the post-COVID crisis right now and what’s going on and the reality that we’re facing in our province. This is a dire situation. People are struggling, people are suffering, and we need to do anything and everything possible to support them.

There were many people who came during the pre-budget consultation, and we thought that there would be a lot of hope—to make sure that we support them.

Right now, we’re facing an affordability crisis. When we talk about the cost of food, the cost of living, housing, rent, it’s impossible—especially with the lack of rent control. The dream of home ownership seems very far away. We’re talking about social housing wait-lists, which is about 85,000 right now—families waiting, people waiting. The LTB has about 38,000 people waiting for hearings. The cost of bills like hydro, gas etc.—everything has gone up. A health care crisis, especially with staffing—recruitment, retaining of staff, especially with Bill 124. The needs in our schools—the amount of infrastructure and staffing that we need in our schools. OW and ODSP—just to keep up with inflation. All of these asks were in the pre-budget consultation. And we hear it from our constituents every single day, and I know members opposite hear that as well.

Many Ontarians tell me about how they wake up at 5 a.m., they work hard, they work and work and work to pay the bills and to put food on the table for their family, and yet it’s just not enough. People are losing hope.

When we look at a budget that the province comes up with—we are hoping that this budget will address those concerns that I just highlighted.

So when we talk about the biggest spending ever—but then I look at this budget. And when the budget was released, as soon as people took a look at it, one of the first things I heard was how cruel this budget is, because it is the biggest spending, and yet the budget missed the mark in addressing so many of the issues that people are facing across this province.

Let me tell you what the Toronto Star editorial board said—and not my words; this is the Toronto Star’s editorial board: that this government is spending, but it’s not getting to the people in the province. From the education sector, to the health care sector, to the community services, to the people, to our children, this budget completely misses the mark.

Instead of a budget that pulls people up when they’re drowning, you have a budget that actually pushes people further into poverty and leaves them behind. Goods and services cost more and more. And this budget does nothing to support those people. When we talk of price gouging, for example—it does nothing.

I want to talk about what happened after the budget was introduced. We were sitting in finance committee and we heard—I have a very limited amount of time so I’m trying to rush through everything that I have here, and I know I won’t get to everything. So let me just start off with one of the organizations that I thought was really interesting in the way they kind of put together the holistic summary of what they’re facing. This was actually Vista Centre Brain Injury Services that came to the deputation for the budget hearings. This is what they said: “In Canada, every 3.5 minutes, there is a brain injury. I will repeat that: In Canada, every 3.5 minutes, there is a brain injury.”

And he went on to talk about what the needs are and how to effectively address this, which means investing in our health care system. What they asked for was an increase in their budget. And Speaker, let me tell you what the government has done so far. Over the last 10 years, they have only received a 2% increase in their budget.

What was really interesting is that from a health care perspective, the Vista Centre Brain Injury Services talked about housing, and I was really intrigued by this because they actually brought it back and said: “Do you know what the number one issue our clients tell us? Housing.” This is what he said: “The number one issue that has been identified in my area is housing, and when I talk about housing, I mean specialized housing not only for people” who are facing “a disability, but people who have an acquired brain injury” as well. And guess what the number of years they wait for it? From 15 to 20 years, they wait for housing.

We heard from other organizations, like non-profit organizations. One of them was Earth Education League, and I want to quote Jodi, because I think she does a fantastic job about Bill 85. She said, “Bill 85 includes funding for school boards for the next academic year at a mere 2.7% increase; 2.7% is significantly below the rate of inflation and won’t meet the students’ needs. Critics have indicated that when accounting tricks are set aside, we are seeing a decrease in per-student funding of nearly $1,000 as a result of this budget. We need to invest in classrooms, in educators and adults in the room, not on online learning, not on TVO and D2L, not on privatization through back doors.”

I thought Jodi just did a fantastic job talking about the needs of our education system and how this budget fails to address that as well.

Speaker, I wish I could share some of the other organizations that talked about their disappointment as well, because not only did the budget not address some of this, they did not even keep up with inflation. They did not even keep up with inflation for our needs in our education, in our health care system, in housing. And yet we have the biggest spending ever in a provincial budget. That’s what the government is bragging about. But it does not go to the people who are struggling, who are suffering, who are hurting right now.

So let’s look at what this government is actually spending the money on, and I hope I can address this in the next few minutes that I have.

Bill 23, which is the result of this government, a bill that they brought forward: What’s happening is that municipalities are losing money and now they don’t have the ability to keep up with a lot of the expenditures that they have. And now that will actually cost taxpayers more money because a lot of municipalities are concerned that they have to raise property taxes.

We also have Highway 413. This government won’t even talk about how much Highway 413 will cost. We’ve got report after report, article after article that talks about how the Premier fails to talk about the exact cost of Highway 413—another idea brought by this government which will pave over wetlands, protected lands. Not only that, it’s going to cost taxpayers a lot of money and the government won’t even tell us exactly how much it’s going to cost. And you know, my colleague the NDP critic for finance and the member from Waterloo, during her presentation, went on about some of the other ways the government is losing revenue for this province as well.

The FAO reported that this government—$6.4 billion didn’t even go where it was supposed to. We have Bonnie Lysyk, the Auditor General—and I want to thank her for her service to this province—who talked about how this government is losing money on the OLG. So not only does the government not have the amount of revenue they’re supposed to be getting, they have a smaller share of revenue coming in and then they’re spending it on the 1%, the 2%, the select few that they choose, and not the people of this province, Speaker. And where—I’m almost out of time.

Ontario Place: You’ve got $650 million that’s going to go to a luxury spa, an Austrian spa—not even a business of this province—$650 million. And then there is a $450-million parking lot that’s supposed to be an underwater parking lot, I think, like the biggest car wash, I guess, that this province has ever seen—the costliest—but this is where the money will be spent.

Then, if you think about Highway 407—this is a comparison I can make because that’s the result we’re facing right now, where we have a 1,200% increase of what the cost of this—

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  • May/17/23 3:50:00 p.m.
  • Re: Bill 85 

I thank the member for her comments. There were a couple of words that I heard from her remarks. One was on housing, and the other was on spending. On housing, I’m delighted to hear the member say that we have a need for housing. I’ll just remind her that this government plans to build a million and a half homes over the next 10 years—an excellent plan—and further, to encourage affordable homes, removing development charges on affordable homes. Also, the Homelessness Prevention Program: $202 million in this budget. I was delighted to hear what I thought was support for these housing initiatives.

On the spending side, this is the budget document. On page 139—people have heard me refer to that before—health care spending will be up $15.3 billion over the next three years. I’m curious as to whether those are important positives for the member to consider.

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  • May/17/23 3:50:00 p.m.
  • Re: Bill 85 

Thank you so much for the opportunity. I want to thank the member for his question. Honestly, I wish this were the type of dialogue that we could have because we need to have a public park, a public space that is serving the people of this province, that is accessible, that won’t cost the people money and actually give profit to a private company that is not even Ontarian.

And not to mention, one of the things that’s really difficult for me is understanding—has the government actually done research on Therme? We’re giving $650 million to a luxury spa. Have we done—like, what their financial track record is? They have a very problematic track record in the UK. Have we done our research to see what they have done, what their track record looks like and what it will mean when we have a 95-year lease for Ontario? Because that’s a defective sale—

Interjection.

That means we need to make sure that people don’t go hungry, don’t go homeless. That is the most important part when we talk about budgets because then you’re prioritizing things like housing, you’re prioritizing things like the amount you need for ODSP and OW. We’re not keeping up with those things. We’re not keeping up with the inflation rate of any of these needs, and that’s what the result is. We’re seeing thousands of people lining up, and some people who have never gone to a food bank are now getting food at a food bank.

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  • May/17/23 3:50:00 p.m.
  • Re: Bill 85 

Thank you very much, Speaker. To the member who just did her best to squeeze all of the voices of Ontario into only 10 minutes, I wanted to ask her some of the things she’s hearing from people whose voices did not make it into this budget.

We’re hearing a lot across communities—and the Conservatives are as well, if they’re listening—from the folks who are dependent upon food banks. Unfortunately, those stats are growing and food banks are reporting that they are meeting new neighbours they’ve never met before, that they are serving people who have jobs, perhaps have a home and a mortgage and who aren’t typically the people they have seen. What is in this budget for them or what could have been a help for them?

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  • May/17/23 3:50:00 p.m.
  • Re: Bill 85 

The member from Scarborough Southwest brought up Ontario Place. This is something that I remember going to as a kid and being one of the coolest places to really, truly go in Toronto and get to experience a little bit of Ontario’s flavour. I don’t understand for the life of me why they want to continually try and block reinvestment and redevelopment in Ontario Place.

To the member from Scarborough Southwest: I certainly hope you don’t ever get caught at the spa there because you guys certainly talk about it a lot, and I just wonder what maybe her vision is. If our vision for Ontario Place isn’t good enough and not what the people want to see for Ontario Place, what does she want to see at Ontario Place? Because maybe it’s something that we can incorporate into it as well.

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