SoVote

Decentralized Democracy

Ontario Assembly

43rd Parl. 1st Sess.
October 30, 2023 09:00AM
  • Oct/30/23 11:00:00 a.m.

Mr. Speaker, unfortunately, the member from Peterborough is correct yet again. The Prime Minister clearly stated that this pause that was announced last week to the federal carbon tax is only going to apply to those who use home heating oil, which is only 2.5% of the people in Ontario, Mr. Speaker.

The vast majority of the people in Ontario—more than 70% of them, Mr. Speaker—are using lower-emission forms of energy, like propane and natural gas, and what they’re going to see is the carbon tax continue to go up and up and up. That means more money out of their pockets, Mr. Speaker, at a time when affordability is tough for people across Ontario.

As the Premier just mentioned, the carbon tax is driving up the price of gasoline—it’s driving up the price of housing, it’s driving up grocery prices, Mr. Speaker.

This change from the federal Liberal government—the government of Canada, Mr. Speaker—is too little, too late. They need to start acting like the government of Canada—

Just this year alone, the federal tax is adding almost $300 to households on their natural gas heating alone, Mr. Speaker. That’s more than $24 a month. The same goes for households that heat with propane, which are already paying $250 more in taxes this year.

But it’s not going to stop there, Mr. Speaker. By 2030, the federal government—with the opposition parties’ support here at Queen’s Park that includes the current Liberal caucus and the NDP opposition, Mr. Speaker—wants to nearly triple the carbon tax across Canada. The feds aren’t done yet, is the bottom line.

Ontarians can’t afford higher taxes, especially at this time, Mr. Speaker, and these parties—the Liberals, the NDP and the federal Liberals—couldn’t be more out of touch. While we’re reducing the cost of living, they’re continuing to make it more and more expensive for the people of Canada.

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  • Oct/30/23 11:00:00 a.m.

Speaker, I have a question for the Minister of Energy.

Last Thursday, the Prime Minister finally recognized what the Premier has been saying for years: The carbon tax is raising the price of everything. After years of pushing energy costs higher, the Prime Minister has finally announced he was pausing the carbon tax—but only on home heating oil and only for three years.

Over the weekend, I heard from many of my constituents who heat with natural gas or propane, who are concerned that the federal government is leaving them out in the cold this winter. No one should be choosing between heating and eating.

Speaker, to the minister: Is it true that the federal government is going to continue to raise the carbon tax on my constituents who heat with natural gas or propane?

I truly do not understand why the federal government is intentionally leaving out Ontarians from relief on their federal taxes on their energy bills.

Families and businesses in my riding have told me that they’re already feeling the impact of the carbon tax on their bills every single month. They can’t afford higher taxes that the opposition Liberals and the NDP want to impose.

Speaker, does the minister know how much higher the good people of Peterborough–Kawartha can expect their energy bills to go if the federal government continues to deny any relief to Ontario?

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  • Oct/30/23 11:00:00 a.m.

Speaker, do you know the last time I was afraid? It was in 2018, when we had to look at the books of the province of Ontario.

Now, let’s listen to what the member opposite just said—and to be clear, the Leader of the Opposition today doubled down on this. They have both said that long-term-care homes are not homes. Well, let me tell you something: When I was the Minister of Long-Term Care—and this Minister of Long-Term Care is doubling down because, you know what, it is a home. It is a home for every single—

Interjections.

Interjections.

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  • Oct/30/23 11:00:00 a.m.

Good morning, everyone.

My question is for the Premier. The government is scared. They’re scared of what the RCMP criminal investigation might uncover about the $8.3-billion greenbelt deal. They’re scared of what might be revealed in the 7,000-page FOI to be released later today. They’re scared that they just can’t maintain their promise to get 1.5 million homes built by 2031. They’re scared that they just don’t have it in them to get it done. That’s why they have to water down the deal.

Mr. Speaker, a bed is not a home, and it should not count as such. We desperately need more long-term-care units, but classifying them as housing is complete malarkey, as experts and analysts did not include these much-needed beds in Ontario’s housing needs. The Premier himself has said that the target numbers actually should be 1.8 million homes, given recent population growth. So why water it down now?

My question—

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  • Oct/30/23 11:10:00 a.m.

Enough of the distractions, Mr. Speaker. The bottom line is, this government is failing on its promise to build homes. The province is relying on accounting trickery, and it’s not even Halloween yet. Rather than actually moving forward with getting homes built, they find loopholes to attempt to reach their goal, like counting long-term-care beds.

Can we just, for once, stop with the distractions, with the debauchery, with the dynamics and focus on the task at hand: to actually build housing—in a housing crisis, no less? There are simple solutions. Be bold. Legalize building up on transit corridors and on provincially owned lands. Start with Danforth Avenue, which runs through the middle of my riding.

My question to the Premier is: When will the government commit to building up along transit corridors and building in our own backyards on provincially owned lands?

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  • Oct/30/23 11:10:00 a.m.

The member asked for some numbers. Let’s give him some numbers, shall we? The 15 years when they propped up the Liberals, they build 611 beds for seniors in this province. That’s over 15 years. This government, since 2018, has built or shovels in the ground, 18,000.

Now, the member questioned counting those spaces in long-term-care homes as homes. Well, I dare the member to go to Pleasant Manor in Niagara Falls, where we just announced hundreds of new beds, and tell the amazing seniors who live there that they are not living in homes. Because our government disagrees, Speaker. They are absolutely homes, and we are building 58,000 of them under this Premier’s leadership. We are not going to take lessons from NDP. We’re going to make sure the seniors in this province have the respect and dignity they—

Interjections.

I dare the member to walk into Niagara, because here are the new homes we are building: Extendicare St. Catharines; Foyer at Welland; Welland extended care unit, Niagara Health system; Southbridge Niagara; Royal Rose Place; Westhills; Pleasant Manor; Garden City Manor; Linhaven long-term care; Fairview. Speaker, walk with me into those homes and tell those hard-working seniors who built this country, who built this community and who gave us our lives as we know it, that they’re not living in a home.

We’re going to continue to make sure we take care of our seniors. They took care of us. We’re going to take care of them. We’re not taking any lessons from the member opposite.

Interjections.

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  • Oct/30/23 11:10:00 a.m.

My question is to the Premier. It has become quite clear to the public that this government is far from meeting their promised housing target of 1.5 million homes. Now we learn that they have quietly included long-term-care beds in their total housing-built numbers. I’m not sure if the minister’s old documents got mixed up with his new portfolio, but he should be clear that Ontario has both a housing crisis and a long-term-care crisis. We’re not fixing either by just padding the numbers.

Could the Premier tell us the real numbers today and let Ontarians know how far off they are from meeting their housing goals?

You don’t need to take lessons from me; I’ll teach you. As we witness the declining housing starts in the province of Ontario, the people of our province are left in dire need. Your solution: just add the numbers together and hope nobody notices. But it’s not accurate, and it means we’re far off from tackling our housing crisis.

Can the Premier come clean with Ontarians: After being forced to reverse all their housing policies for the past year—and we know why that happened—is creative math the only solution he has left to the housing crisis?

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  • Oct/30/23 11:10:00 a.m.

I want to thank the member from Carleton for a great question. She’s absolutely right once again: Heating fuels like natural gas and propane are often the only options for people in rural and remote parts of Ontario, including our First Nations. Over 70% of Ontarians heat their homes with natural gas and propane. Just this year alone, the federal carbon tax, as we’ve already established, is adding hundreds of dollars to those customers’ bills, making life more unaffordable—it’s about $25 a month per family.

These families and households are still facing the same challenges as the 2.5% of people who use home heating fuel. They’re the only ones that are being exempted from the carbon tax by Canada’s federal government. It doesn’t make any sense. Why are we not exempting all of those other people that are heating with natural gas and propane from the carbon tax as well?

I want to thank the member from Lanark–Frontenac–Kingston for a great motion, and hopefully the Liberal caucus here will stop turning themselves in knots—

Interjection.

The Premier has already said it this morning: The carbon tax is wrong. It’s not fair to the people of Ontario. We need the opposition parties in this Legislature to join us and encourage the feds to scrap—

Interjections.

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  • Oct/30/23 11:10:00 a.m.

My question is to the Minister of Energy. My colleague the member for Lanark–Frontenac–Kingston has put forward a strong motion that calls on the federal government to take immediate steps to eliminate the carbon tax on fuels and inputs for home heating.

For many individuals and families, especially in northern Ontario, the use of fuels to heat their homes is a necessity, not a luxury. Unfortunately, for many people in rural, remote, and northern Ontario cities, they are extremely limited in the options they have when it comes to heating their homes. It is not right and it is unfair that they are being punished by this regressive carbon tax simply because of the fuel that they need to survive.

Speaker, through you, can the minister please speak to what impact eliminating the carbon tax would have on the energy bills of so many Ontarians, especially in rural, remote and northern communities?

Unfortunately, not everyone in the Legislature shares the same view about the negative impacts that the carbon tax has had on so many Ontarians and our electricity system. As we saw last week, the opposition Liberals voted against our motion to remove the carbon tax on groceries.

Speaker, through you, can the minister please share the concerns of so many Ontarians regarding why anyone would ever support this regressive carbon tax?

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  • Oct/30/23 11:10:00 a.m.

Stop the clock. I’m going to caution the Premier on his language, and I’m going to allow him to continue.

Supplementary question?

The supplementary question.

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  • Oct/30/23 11:10:00 a.m.

Well, Mr. Speaker, you know something? I have a great respect for Triple M over there, but sometimes the cheese slips off the cracker.

In your own riding, Triple M, we created 370 long-term—

Interjections.

But they voted against creating more long-term-care homes. They voted against hospitals, voted against the roads to get to the hospitals, voted against the highways to get to the hospitals. They would be against a permit to build a doghouse; they’d vote against it. That’s what they’re about. We get the job done. They sit back, and all they do is complain.

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  • Oct/30/23 11:20:00 a.m.

My question is to the Minister of Energy. Unlike the opposition Liberals and NDP, our government has always known that the carbon tax is driving up energy prices across this province. That’s why our Premier and our government took our fight against this useless and regressive tax all the way to the Supreme Court. As we head into the winter, I’m glad to see that the federal government is starting to understand the harmful effects of the carbon tax, but they did not go far enough.

Speaker, can the minister please explain why the federal government would only pause the carbon tax on home heating oil, which is more emitting and used by only 2.5% of Ontarians, instead of natural gas, which is less emitting and used by, let’s say, 70%?

As we head into the winter, home heating costs are top of mind for our families in my community. They’re looking for us to put in place policies that are going to reduce costs, not increase them.

Speaker, can the minister please explain what our government is going to do, and keep doing, to keep costs down for families across Ontario?

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  • Oct/30/23 11:20:00 a.m.

The member’s question is a pretty difficult one to answer, because the federal government’s approach to scrapping the carbon tax doesn’t make much sense at all. The federal Liberals have decided to pause the carbon tax on one type of home heating fuel, but continue to increase the costs for those who use less emitting types of home heating fuel, like natural gas and propane.

Most of the people here in Ontario, as I have already said, more than 70% of the people in Ontario are using those lower-emissions fuels. Ontario families just shouldn’t be punished because of a decision made by the Prime Minister and his team in Ottawa. The feds need to expand this pause for all people across Ontario. They’re the government of Canada and they should be putting a pause on this for all residents across Canada, not just in Atlantic Canada. It’s time that the opposition parties stand with us and oppose this federal carbon tax once—

When it comes to home heating and natural gas, we need the federal government to come to the table and join us in trying to make life more affordable for the people of Ontario, not just the people of Atlantic Canada but for people across Canada.

As the Premier said this morning, this tax is wrong. It’s hurting people in Ontario. It’s hurting people right across Canada. It’s not fair to the people and we should—

As the Minister of Agriculture has been saying for a couple of years now, Mr. Speaker, it’s driving up the cost of fruits and vegetables in our grocery stores. And it’s pretty simple, because the carbon tax is applied to the fertilizer that the farmers are using. The carbon tax is applied to the fuel that runs their tractors. The carbon tax drives up the cost of the distributors’ trucks to get it to the grocery store. Then, the carbon tax also drives up the cost of energy at those grocery stores, and it drives up the cost of the individual’s fuel to go to the grocery store to get the fruits and vegetables.

This is a terrible tax. We’ve been fighting this tax here on this side of the House since 2018. We need the federal government and we need opposition to come together to make life more affordable for Ontarians.

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  • Oct/30/23 11:20:00 a.m.

Last week, on October 23, four people, including three children aged six, seven and 12, were fatally shot in Sault Ste. Marie. Police are calling the shootings a result of intimate partner violence. The Premier called the news “gut-wrenching,” but his words ring hollow when he refuses to even act on the first recommendation of the Renfrew inquest, which is to declare intimate partner violence an epidemic.

I’ll give the Premier one more chance today to stand with survivors. Will the Premier support cities and their public health officials by finally declaring intimate partner violence an epidemic?

Speaker, we need to talk about how intimate partner violence harms and kills children as they live with their mothers. On average, a woman is killed by an intimate partner every six days in Canada, and as of September 30, there have been 46 femicides in Ontario alone, and that number has now become higher. The Canadian Domestic Homicide Prevention Initiative has found at least 30 children are killed annually in Canada by one of their parents.

Speaker, the clock is running out. When will the Premier finally take action to protect children and their mothers by declaring intimate partner violence an epidemic?

Interjections.

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  • Oct/30/23 11:20:00 a.m.

My question is to the Minister of Energy.

As the Premier said last month, “The delivery of every product we have in the province is being affected by the worst tax this country has ever seen—it’s a useless tax—and that’s the carbon tax.” I absolutely agree with the Premier on this, because while our government has remained laser-focused on lowering costs, the carbon tax is working against us.

Speaker, we have heard a lot about the high cost of energy bills today, but can the minister also please explain how the carbon tax is driving up the costs of everything else?

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  • Oct/30/23 11:20:00 a.m.

Mr. Speaker, this is a serious matter and our thoughts are with the victims and their families. But symbolism does not effect change. That’s why we know that this is an all-systems partner that will be engaged, and we’re taking a broad lens.

I said last week there were concrete things that we’re doing. We’re enhancing the training at the Ontario Police College for the newest cadets, and I’ve seen this for myself. I said that we are giving grants to 45 organizations that will help people in their communities through victim services. This is part of a $55-million investment that we’re doing. And, Mr. Speaker, we will also and always hold the offenders to account.

But Mr. Speaker, as I said before, we’re engaging all partners to act, and we’re looking at this through a broad lens. Most importantly, we will hold the offenders to account for their actions, which are absolutely inappropriate.

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  • Oct/30/23 11:20:00 a.m.

Order. I’m sure we all had a nice weekend and we’ve come back to the House with a great deal of enthusiasm. It’s wonderful to see it, especially this close to Halloween. However, I can’t hear what’s being said in the House. I would ask the House to come to order or I will start calling members out by name and graduate from there, if necessary.

Start the clock. The next question.

Next question.

The Solicitor General.

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  • Oct/30/23 11:30:00 a.m.
  • Re: Bill 143 

This bill proclaims the week beginning on the third Monday of September in each year as Harvest Season Road Safety Week.

Mr. Pang moved first reading of the following bill:

Bill Pr36, An Act to revive Eastern Children of Israel Congregation.

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  • Oct/30/23 11:30:00 a.m.

The supplementary question.

The next question.

The supplementary question.

The next question.

Call in the members. This is a five-minute bell.

The division bells rang from 1141 to 1146.

Mr. Mamakwa has moved private member’s notice of motion number 66. All those in favour, please rise and remain standing until recognized by the Clerk.

Motion negatived.

This House stands in recess until 1 p.m.

The House recessed from 1150 to 1300.

Mr. Harris moved first reading of the following bill:

Bill 143, An Act to proclaim Harvest Season Road Safety Week / Projet de loi 143, Loi proclamant la Semaine de la sécurité routière pendant la saison des récoltes.

First reading agreed to.

First reading agreed to.

On the Standing Committee on Procedure and House Affairs, Ms. Taylor replaces Ms. Bell; and

On the Standing Committee on Finance and Economic Affairs, Mr. Kernaghan replaces Ms. Begum and Ms. Hazell replaces Ms. Brady; and

On the Standing Committee on Social Policy, Ms. Andrew replaces Mrs. Gretzky; and Mr. Gates is removed; and Ms. Brady is added; and

On the Standing Committee on Heritage, Infrastructure and Cultural Policy, Ms. Armstrong replaces Ms. Andrew; and

On the Standing Committee on the Interior, Mr. Bourgouin replaces Ms. Stiles and Mrs. McCrimmon is added; and

On the Standing Committee on Government Agencies, Mr. Glover replaces Ms. Begum and Mrs. Gretzky replaces Mr. Bourgouin.

Is it the pleasure of the House that the motion carry? Carried.

Motion agreed to.

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  • Oct/30/23 11:30:00 a.m.

Thank you to the minister for his response. This is exactly why our government spoke up about that carbon tax and why we fought it tooth and nail, because we knew it would increase the cost of everything in our communities. The most concerning part about the carbon tax is that it will only get worse; the federal government and opposition parties want to nearly triple the tax by 2030.

Speaker, can the minister please explain why Ontario families cannot afford the tax increase the Liberals and the NDP are planning and pushing for?

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