44th Parl. 1st Sess.
May 2, 2024 10:00AM
- May/2/24 12:32:22 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I hope to find unanimous consent to vote yea.
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- May/2/24 12:32:22 p.m.
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I apologize, but with unanimous consent we can do all kinds of things here.
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moved that Bill C-49, An Act to amend the Canada—Newfoundland and Labrador Atlantic Accord Implementation Act and the Canada—Nova Scotia Offshore Petroleum Resources Accord Implementation Act and to make consequential amendments to other Acts, be read the third time and passed.
He said: Mr. Speaker, I am honoured to have the opportunity to speak to Bill C‑49 today.
People in Newfoundland and Labrador have relied on the ocean's resources for centuries. It is what we know. It feels somewhat historic when we talk about the Atlantic accord. Someone not from Newfoundland and Labrador might not realize the significance of the agreement. Particularly for Newfoundland and Labrador, the Atlantic accord is fundamental to the respect and recognition shown between federal and provincial governments.
The accord was an agreement signed in 1985 that bound the Government of Canada and the Government of Newfoundland and Labrador to a common understanding that the people of our province are the principal beneficiaries of their natural resources. The Atlantic accord recognized what my province brought into this country. It recognized the historic resource strengths of Newfoundland and Labrador, and today it recognizes that strength for the future because now the accord would apply to renewable energy, to wind energy.
A Newfoundlander's talking about wind may come as a joke to some. We do have a huge opportunity in harnessing the wind in our province. We have a lot of it, wind that will power not just the grid but also some groundbreaking hydrogen projects. The province knows it and so do we. It is why we work so closely together to manage and develop that resource. The bill before us represents a moment of opportunity, and down my way, we know how to seize opportunity when it comes.
Times were bleak after the cod moratorium until “first oil”, until Hibernia, when we really did not have a clue what we were doing. I remember “first oil”. We knew, though, that it was possible. We knew it could be done. Jointly managed and regulated through the soon-to-be-former C-NLOPB, we stayed the course and people prospered. We did this in what the president of ExxonMobil told me was one of the harshest environments in the world to operate, but we did find a way. More important, we built up one of the most skilled labour forces that the world has ever seen. and people noticed. Companies noticed, much like they are looking to us now.
In 2019, we renewed the accord. We established a Hibernia dividend for the Province of Newfoundland and Labrador, which was $3.3 billion of secure, long-term and predictable payments that run from 2019 to 2056. More important, it also recognized the province as the principal beneficiary of its resources. I am very proud to have helped negotiate the agreement, and I stand by the document.
Now is the time to renew the accord again. In fact, to call the amendments “amendments to the accord” feels a little wrong. It is a natural evolution because the world is evolving. Where we get our energy is evolving and investment is evolving. The Atlantic accord would include renewable energy so Newfoundlanders and Labradorians could be the principal beneficiaries of that too. We would not be losing what we built on the offshore. We are very proud of it actually.
People of my province and the government there are hand-in-glove with this when it comes to the energy mix. We accept the world as it is. We embrace it. We applaud the engineering skills that built a West White Rose gravity structure, because they are the same skills that will help construct wind turbines and the monopiles that are stored next door in Argentia.
Let us think about all the jobs that come with this work; as Minister of Labour, I know I do. When we have a good management structure in place, the more projects that we attract and build and the more jobs that they bring, the better. They are good, well-paying jobs. Right now there are oil and gas companies across Canada that are making sure that the expertise of our workers can be used to build renewable energy projects, and we are going to need every worker we can get because big things are happening and they are happening quickly, but they will not happen as quickly if we do not have the workers.
I have said this before: If someone grows up on a rock in the middle of the ocean or if they grow up in a small town in Labrador like I did, they cannot afford ideology. They grow up seeing the world as it is, not as they wish it to be. They accept the world as it is. They accept opportunities for what they are, and they are clear-eyed about it.
Between the Minister of Rural Economic Development, the member for Avalon, the member for Bonavista—Burin—Trinity, the member for Labrador, the member for St. John's East and me, we knew the accord would need to reflect the changes in the times. As companies and markets look to renewables, Newfoundland and Labrador needs to be well managed. It needs to be well positioned, and when it comes to energy, Newfoundlanders and Labradorians do not like playing catch-up; we like to lead. Even our province's oil and gas industry association's biggest champion, Noia, changed its name to reflect the global shift in energy; it is now Energy NL. Sustainability and reducing emissions has become the name of the game, so Energy NL's vision is a sustainable and prosperous lower-carbon energy industry.
With all of the wind, we are now seeing big hydrogen projects on our doorsteps, first-of-their-kind facilities. When I was the natural resources minister and we were developing Canada's hydrogen plan, never did I think I would see the German chancellor's plane one day land on the west coast of Newfoundland at Stephenville airport, carrying the CEOs of Seaman and Mercedes. They were saying that they could invest in and create a green hydrogen facility anywhere they choose to, and that they chose us.
If people have not been out my way, I can tell them that it can get windy. The winds off the Atlantic coast rival those of the North Sea, which is the birthplace of the world's offshore wind industry. This gives Newfoundland and Labrador and Nova Scotia a once-in-a-generation opportunity to become the leaders in an energy sector of the future, to support our region's industrial future and create good jobs that will exist for generations to come.
It is expected that the offshore wind industry will attract one trillion dollars' worth of investment by 2040. We would be out of our minds to think we would not be ready for that kind of money and those kinds of jobs. We are talking about renewable energy. That is a change, one that sometimes makes people anxious. However, this is not about politics; it is about markets, investments and jobs. Industry understands something that skeptics do not, which is that the world is looking for renewable energy, wind and solar, in the overall energy mix.
We can sit on our hands and let those industries be built in other countries and let their workers get the good jobs, or we can get in on the ground floor and make sure that workers here get the jobs. We can make sure that Canadian workers, Atlantic Canadian workers, Newfoundlanders and Labradorians, are the ones who will be selling renewable energy to the world and taking home the profits.
We are going to ensure a great future for the people of my home province, Newfoundland and Labrador.
By passing Bill C-49, we would secure Newfoundland and Labrador's and Nova Scotia's futures as forces to be reckoned with in the global offshore wind and renewable energy sectors.
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- May/2/24 12:40:12 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I would like to commend the hon. minister on his speech. My area has the second-largest group of people who came from his province to work in the resource sector for many years, and we have a strong connection with his province. I appreciate that he believes the resource sector is responsible, and its workers have tremendous skills.
The one thing I would ask him is this: What is the government going to build, and what resource sector would it depend on for all the parts and pieces to build it and the fluids to drive it?
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- May/2/24 12:40:50 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I would say to the hon. member that it is oil and gas. I do not know whether that is such a difficult answer to say, but it is oil and gas, and proudly so.
In fact if we look at wind turbines, they take an awful lot of copper, about 60,000 pounds, so there is a lot of mining involved not just in this country but around the world. All of this brings good Canadian jobs if we play our cards right.
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- May/2/24 12:41:18 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, during the committee's study, the Bloc Québécois proposed a number of amendments, including the idea of conducting seabed impact studies before developing wind turbines, which was rejected by the Liberals, among others.
I have a simple question. Was it simply to avoid setting a precedent for oil and gas development on the seabed, so that there can never really be an environmental assessment or an impact assessment before drilling takes place?
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- May/2/24 12:41:49 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I fail to see the logic of the hon. member's question. It seems to lean on whether or not oil and gas or renewables are treated the same. Let me assure her that the piece of legislation before us is such a fundamentally sound piece of legislation in the Atlantic accord and has built such a proud and prosperous industry off the shores of my home province that asking me to extend that jurisdiction, which is respectful of provincial jurisdiction, is something that I would think most members of the House would abide by.
By making sure that our governments work together and that provincial jurisdictions are upheld, we can work together to build a new industry in the same regulatory regime in renewables: wind and hydrogen. We do not have to say no to say yes to others. All of these are going to be important parts of the energy mix.
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- May/2/24 12:42:50 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, New Democrats worked long and hard to make sure that this project for Newfoundland and Labrador and Nova Scotia got off the ground, because we need to get serious about the renewable sector.
What worries me is that the rest of the world is moving much faster. Our main competitor is the United States. There is one project in Rhode Island where 250,000 homes will get energy, and the Vineyard project is 400,000 homes. The Europeans are moving, and China is leaving everybody in the dust, and yet the ITCs, the input tax credits promised by the government in 2023, are still not out there. I am talking to people in the industry, the mining industry in particular, who are looking to go stateside.
We cannot build this new economy without kick-starting the ITC credits that are needed. When are they going to come out? We cannot leave our regions behind.
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- May/2/24 12:43:45 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, the ITCs are something new, which actually builds the argument for what we are talking about with this piece of legislation. Why would we create something new when what we have works so well? Investment tax credits are new to this country. In particular, I am very proud to say that some of the ITCs are dependent and would only be activated, in other words, investors and companies would only realize them, if investors make sure that union wages are paid or union members are hired. In this case, we have a regulatory regime that works.
If we want renewables to succeed, as the hon. member brings up, as competition begins, why would we go back to the drawing board and start a whole new regulatory regime for renewables? It would take way too long. Let us use what we have, which works so well. That is what the provinces of Nova Scotia and Newfoundland and Labrador are asking us to do.
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- May/2/24 12:44:44 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, with the minister being a colleague of mine from Newfoundland and Labrador, I am sure he is very proud of the oil industry in our province. He mentioned the Port of Argentia. I am sure he remembers being there to announce a $38-million investment as the port gets involved in wind energy.
I wonder if the minister could talk about that and how important it is to that particular region.
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- May/2/24 12:45:09 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, the hon. member knows I love Argentia and I like taking people to Argentia.
The energy transition is going to be complicated, as the hon. member knows, and I am very proud of my province in the fact that as we continue in one energy sector, we are working in another energy sector. In fact, our industry association has changed its name from NOIA now to Energy NL, with the express purpose of looking at ways to lower emissions and looking at the overall energy mix and how they all work together.
I am very proud of Argentia as we see the gravity-based structure for the West White Rose project being built. It is being built with wheelbarrows. What they had to do is unbelievable. Right next door to it is the biggest monopile marshalling port on the eastern seaboard. This is where they are stacking all those big monopiles that are going to go up and down the eastern seaboard. These are the same workers, and I am very proud of them. It is a workforce with some of the best experts, when it comes to energy, in the world, developed in the past 30 years in my province. It is taking over the world. It is something to be proud of.
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- May/2/24 12:46:16 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I would ask my hon. colleague across the way if he will support the Conservative amendments, given that we consulted with the likes of Mr. Max Ruelokke, who I am sure the member is well aware of, with over 40 years' experience in the management of offshore petroleum resources in Newfoundland and Labrador and Nova Scotia and in consultations worldwide. In fact, he was the chair and CEO of the C-NLOPB for six years. I am sure my hon. colleague respects him quite highly.
I heard the minister mention earlier the good union jobs. There are also amendments that were suggested by the FFAW-Unifor, which, in committee, were voted down in a very partisan manner. All Conservatives want is to make this bill work so that the oil and gas industry, the fishing industry and the renewable energy industries can work together and bring investor confidence back to those resource-based industries in Newfoundland and Labrador.
Will the minister support the people of Newfoundland and Labrador and vote for the common-sense Conservative amendments?
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- May/2/24 12:47:52 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I honestly cannot wait to vote against those amendments, in the same way I could not wait to say no to 20,000 amendments that that party put forward to try to block this piece of legislation. That is not practical investing. That is not investing in the future. That is hoodwinking. This member has accused the premiers of those two provinces of being hoodwinked by us. He has accused us of hoodwinking the Premier of Nova Scotia and the Premier of Newfoundland and Labrador. I do not think so.
Conservatives have done everything they can to get in the way of this.
The Progressive Conservative Party, which I have spoken very highly of, and John Crosbie, whom I would consider a mentor to me, built this industry, but we know what the Conservative Party has done with this industry. For goodness' sake, when it took 300 days for an environmental assessment for just an exploratory well, Conservatives found a way to make it 900 days. They are the kings of red tape when it comes to our offshore industry. We have reduced it to 90 days.
They think I am going to pay attention to their amendments because, clutch my pearls, we are being partisan. I do not think so. Get out of the way of investment. Get out of the way of jobs. Get out of the way of the future. This is happening and we are leading.
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Mr. Speaker, it is an absolute honour to rise again in the people's House and to address this important bill that is before our consideration here today.
Bill C-49 shows a continued lack of true consultation by the current government with stakeholders and on-the-ground industry workers, who have continuously come out to speak out against this bill with fervour. This is the furthest thing from bottom-up legislation, legislation based on feedback given by the people who would be most affected by these decisions. Good legislation would have taken that into consideration and made sure the voices of those who are most impacted by a certain piece of legislation are truly considered and implemented into the government's approach. That is clearly not the case here.
Industry stakeholders, fish harvesters, those in the offshore industry and residents of those provinces are raising legitimate concerns. What we, as His Majesty's loyal opposition, are doing is bringing those concerns to the fore. We are using every tool available to us to make sure that those concerns are heard, whether that is through amendments or through making sure that due diligence is done at committee and in this chamber. Those voices have a right to be heard, and our job is to make sure those voices are brought to the fore. That is how we get to better legislation. Our aim is to fix the bill. Our aim is to help the legislation become what it should be.
The Liberals have ignored those legitimate, absolutely positive amendments that were brought forward. They are not considering those things that the stakeholders themselves and the residents of Newfoundland and Labrador and Nova Scotia are bringing forward. I think it is so important that the government take the time to consider those very legitimate concerns.
I am a proud member from the region of Atlantic Canada. I am excited to represent a region in New Brunswick. One thing that has frustrated me and, I know, other colleagues from Atlantic Canada on this side of the House is the fact that we have so much potential that has yet to be realized. There is so much potential that has yet to be fully tapped into. Those in the industry and those whose livelihoods depend upon this are clearly saying there are a lot of things that we could do.
Our provinces could take advantage of a lot of the resources that are literally under our feet and in our waters, if we only had a government that would listen to our concerns, get off our backs, get out of the way and allow us to do what we do best. Instead, we are putting up more roadblocks and we are putting undue power in the hands of one minister who, with the strike of a pen, could veto a lot of tremendous potential development that could take place in our region.
Atlantic Canada, like other parts of this country, many times has felt ignored, isolated and marginalized by the current federal government. Atlantic Canadians are speaking loudly and clearly. They want the government to hear that they have concerns with this bill as it is written: “Fix the bill. Make the bill better. Make sure it reflects the legitimate concerns of those whose opportunities and future livelihoods truly depend upon it.” We have heard it from fish harvesters, we have heard it from oil and gas workers and we have heard it from various stakeholders.
Mr. Scott Tessier, chief executive officer for the Canada-Newfoundland and Labrador Offshore Petroleum Board, said that the petroleum sector and the fishing sector “are absolutely critical to our province and the economy of Canada, so it is absolutely critical to have an effective consultation and engagement framework in which fisheries interests are at the table with a meaningful say and a full voice.” We need to make sure that people's voices from those sectors are being considered and reflected in this type of legislation that is brought forward.
Mr. Michael Barron, the president of the Cape Breton Fish Harvesters Association, said that “a more involved in-depth consultation needs to be had with other primary users of this space moving forward.”
What will accompany this bill will strain the energy sector and give the minister the ability to veto energy projects brought forth by industry workers. We are hearing this coming from across sectors. They are raising concerns, and the real, legitimate problems, as has now been borne out by a federal court saying that Bill C-69 is unconstitutional, are once again being raised in regard to Bill C-49.
If a bill is being built on the back of a bill that has already been deemed unconstitutional by a federal court, the Liberals may want to go back to the drawing board to reconsider it, and see that this may be a little bit of a stretch and they had better address the concerns so they do not run into the same legal problems of implementation they are having with Bill C-69.
It is worthy of consideration, and it is worthy of going back to the drawing board to make sure we get this right. It is more important to get a piece of legislation through that is good and right than it is to just get a piece of legislation through for the sake of saying that we got it through. These concerns need to be heard and need to be brought forward.
There is so much potential. This is an area of passion for me, whether it was when I was spending my time on the natural resources committee or on the fisheries committee. One thing I hear from industry stakeholders in both sectors is how much potential there is within each of their sectors that is unrealized and untapped. They feel like, every time they go ahead to take advantage of the opportunities within those sectors, there is a big, heavy hand of government and bureaucracy that comes down on their backs, saying that they cannot do this, go there or expand in this area, and the only way they could grow and develop is the government's way, as old Frank Sinatra famously used to sing, do it My Way, and if they do not, then it is the highway. Quite frankly, we need to get them at the table so they have the opportunity to expand, grow, develop, and realize the potential that is theirs.
When I was preparing my remarks today, I could not help myself, and I had to go to this famous old story. It is one I heard years ago as a young man. I hope the House will indulge me. Members may recognize it as I read it. There is a reason why this old story came back to me today, and maybe members can relate to it somewhat. When I think of Atlantic Canada and our potential, and I think of the frustrations that we have felt as Atlantic Canadians, oftentimes being overlooked, this story comes to mind. It says:
In a world of hills, so steep and high, Lived a little blue engine, reaching for the sky. With a heart so bold and wheels that could,The Little Engine faced a challenge understood. On a sunny day, with a load so grand, A shiny new train was stuck in the sand.The passengers fretted, their spirits so low,They needed help to make their journey go. The shiny trains, big and strong,Said, “We can't help, the hill's too long.”But the Little Engine, with a gleam in its eye, Stepped forward, ready to give it a try.“I think I can, I think I can,” it said, Climbing the hill with hope widespread.Coal-fired determination, puffing and chugging,The Little Engine's spirit was truly tugging. The hill was steep, the challenge immense,Yet the Little Engine, with confidence,Chanted its mantra, clear and loud, “I think I can, I'm strong and proud.”Up the hill, the Little Engine strained,Raindrops falling, courage gained. “I think I can, I think I can,” it cried,As it chugged along with a sense of pride. Passing others who doubted its might, The Little Engine pressed on with all its might. “I thought I could, I thought I could,” it sang,As over the mountains, its triumph rang.A tale of courage, resilience so true,For the Little Engine, and for me and you.A journey of belief, where dreams unfold, “I knew I could,” a story retold.To the little ones, with dreams so wide,The Little Engine whispers, right by your side,With “I think I can” echoing through the air,You'll conquer any hill, if only you dare.
What is the lesson of the little engine that could, and how does it relate to Atlantic Canada and Bill C-49? It is that we have so much potential and so much we can do. We have so much we want to do. The last thing the little locomotives of New Brunswick, Prince Edward Island, Nova Scotia, and Newfoundland and Labrador need is a great, big locomotive called the federal government saying “No, you can't. No, you can't. No, you can't.”
What we need is someone to stand on the side of the little provinces to say, “Yes, you can. Yes, you can. Yes, you can. There is hope. Yes, it can get better.” Let us tap into our potential, utilize our resources and climb the hills of challenge that face us by utilizing all of the above, as well as the renewable energy and existing energy resources, to expand, grow and do all that we can.
With this, I must introduce an amendment.
I move:
That the motion be amended by deleting all the words after the word “That” and substituting the following: Bill C-49, An Act to amend the Canada-Newfoundland and Labrador Atlantic Accord Implementation Act and the Canada-Nova Scotia Offshore Petroleum Resources Accord Implementation Act and to make consequential amendments to other Acts, be not now read a third time, but be referred back to the Standing Committee on Natural Resources for the purpose of reconsidering Clauses 61, 62, 169 and 170 with the view to prevent uncertainty and a lack of clarity caused by the inclusion of similar provisions contained in Bill C-69, an Act to enact the Impact Assessment Act and the Canadian Energy Regulator Act, to amend the Navigation Protection Act and to make consequential amendments to other Acts, which would insert unanticipated conditions and requirements beyond existing legislation and regulations through these clauses.
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- May/2/24 1:01:19 p.m.
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The amendment is in order.
We will move on to questions and comments. The hon. parliamentary secretary to the government House leader has the floor.
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Mr. Speaker, it was an interesting story. I would say to the member that, yes, he can. He can realize the potential by passing Bill C-49, which has the premiers of the provinces that are most affected recognizing the true value of it, as it is. I would ask the member to reflect on the great potential Atlantic Canada, in particular the two provinces in question, would have through the passage of this legislation.
I saw the passion in the speeches of the minister and others, particularly those from Atlantic Canada, when they talked about the future and how wonderful the future is, as well as the potential of this legislation. They are joined by the premiers of both Nova Scotia and Newfoundland and Labrador.
Why does he not say that, yes, he can convince his Atlantic caucus colleagues, at the very least, to get behind Bill C-49 and do the right thing by supporting it? By supporting it, he would be supporting Atlantic Canada.
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- May/2/24 1:03:35 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I will tell members what we can do. We can do our jobs as His Majesty's loyal opposition to make sure that what gets passed through the House is actually reflective of those whose livelihoods are most dependant upon the very industries that are most affected by the impacts of this bill. We have heard overwhelmingly from those industry stakeholders that this is a flawed bill that needs to be amended and corrected.
We are doing our job and, yes, we can, and, yes, we will. We will keep fighting to make it a better piece of legislation, so that the concerns of all Canadians, including Atlantic Canadians, are heard.
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- May/2/24 1:04:15 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I would like my colleague to provide some clarification. He gave a rather eloquent speech, but I would like to understand why the Conservatives are opposing a bill that promotes greenwashing and that does absolutely nothing to reduce offshore petroleum operations. I would like to understand the Conservatives' position, because, from what I understand, the goal of the Conservative MPs is to protect the interests of the oil and gas industry and ensure that there is as much oil and gas development as possible, which is something this bill allows for. That is why I do not understand the Conservatives' position.
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- May/2/24 1:04:51 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, the answer is very clear. I find it intriguing that the hon. member from the Bloc Québécois is raising a concern about how we are standing up to reflect the concerns that stakeholders and provinces have raised.
These concerns are regarding way too much power being granted to a federal minister. They could come in to stamp out some provincial industries and the areas that impact provinces and regions within their jurisdiction. It takes way too much power away from the provinces and puts way too much into the hands of an overreaching, over-encroaching federal government. In particular, a federal minister could have veto power over energy development and resource development.
As our western friends in Alberta and Saskatchewan know very well, the over-encroachment of the federal government into areas of provincial jurisdiction is stifling and hampering. It hurts business and industry. I am sure my colleague from Quebec would be very concerned if federal ministers started overreaching into areas of provincial jurisdiction. We share that concern, and I hope the member would be onside with our concern regarding that.
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- May/2/24 1:06:18 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, as a prairie girl, this is a little outside of my zone, but I do come from Alberta. The member, in answering the question of my colleague from the Bloc, brought up the example of the oil and gas sector in Alberta and the need for the federal government not to overreach.
One of the problems I have is that, on occasion, provincial governments, and I would use the example of the Alberta provincial government, do not do a particularly good job of promoting renewables or promoting forward-looking industry. As members know, Danielle Smith paused renewables in Alberta, and $33 billion dollars' worth of investment was chased from our province.
From the member's perspective, is there a place for the federal government to ensure strings are attached?
Another example would be when money came from the federal government for orphan wells to be cleaned up in Alberta. There were no strings attached, despite the fact the NDP asked for them, and the wells in Alberta have still not been cleaned up.
Does he not see the federal government has to have some role to play in developing our resources and in making sure that resources are being developed adequately?
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