SoVote

Jun/4/24 6:36:50 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I understand why my colleague from Beauport—Limoilou would ask that question. When I look at the bill's timeline, I can see that it has been before Parliament for quite some time. That is probably one good reason to pass it speedily. The committee spent a significant number of meetings on this bill, during which our colleagues amended it. Our government recognizes the importance of having a civilian authority mandated by law to oversee both the Canada Border Services Agency and the RCMP. We all know of situations where that kind of independent civilian oversight would have been desirable. I think it is time for the House of Commons to vote on this bill, and I hope my colleagues will support it.

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Mr. Peter Julian (New Westminster—Burnaby, NDP)

Jun/4/24 6:38:03 p.m.
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Re: Bill C-20

Madam Speaker, the NDP worked assiduously to improve this legislation, and we had to do it with the Conservatives blocking it at every single stage. What I found were delays at the committee level, when we tried repeatedly to have meetings to hear from witnesses, and each time it was blocked by the Conservatives. Despite that fact, because we are the worker bees in the House of Commons, the NDP worked to improve this bill, Bill C-20, which is a necessary bill. We had about a dozen improvements to the legislation, including banning the use of non-disclosure agreements to silence victims, ensuring there was no intimidation that could be imposed, ensuring union representation and increasing transparency. All those things improve the legislation and are needed. Why have Conservatives blocked legislation like this, which is something that is needed and which all parties understand that it needs to be adopted through Parliament?

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Hon. Dominic LeBlanc

Jun/4/24 6:39:13 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I have had the chance to work with our colleague, the House leader of the New Democratic Party, over a number of years. He is an experienced, dedicated parliamentarian. I might have even given him the title of “worker bee” as well. He has been, and his colleagues in his caucus have been, extraordinarily constructive in committee in improving this legislation. We worked happily with our colleagues from the New Democratic Party. The member for New Westminster—Burnaby in particular brought a number of thoughtful amendments. He identified the improvements the committee made to this legislation. We were pleased that it was an example of a parliamentary process working well. I share his concern. I am dumbfounded as well why the Conservatives would resist having independent, legislated, civilian oversight, for the first time ever, of the Canada Border Services Agency and having strengthened oversight of the RCMP. We thought parliamentarians would be in favour of this. Canadians are in favour of it. It is pretty disingenuous for Conservatives to bring amendments, for example, to delete the short title just to make sure the legislation does not come to a vote. That is what we are trying to fix this evening.

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Oversight

Mr. Frank Caputo (Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, CPC)

Jun/4/24 6:40:43 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, it is always a pleasure to rise on behalf of the people of Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo. The minister speaks about the urgency with which we really need to pass this legislation, yet here we are. I was going to say it is déjà vu, but it really cannot be déjà vu because this is my first term. Those who have served three terms can actually say it is déjà vu. In fact, I am looking right now at the Library of Parliament summary that we have on this, and it is dated August 30, 2022. The government says that we need to move quickly and we have to truncate the rights of debate of members. How can the minister possibly square that with the fact that the Liberal government has been sitting on this legislation for the third time now and for about two years?

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Urgency

Hon. Dominic LeBlanc

Jun/4/24 6:41:34 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, the member for Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo is in his first term in this Parliament, and he is correct that he would not have seen previous Parliaments that were not able to pass this legislation. However, we can conclude that this simple fact would behoove all of us to work collaboratively, as the committee did, and the support of the Conservatives at committee, for example, was important. What we do not understand, and I think what other parliamentarians may not understand, is why the Conservatives are now seeking, through a series of frivolous amendments, to delete the short title. We think the idea of having an independent civilian oversight of national security agencies is important, which is something the Conservatives of course resisted when they were in government. Maybe it is an extension of their same hesitancy to set up a national security committee of parliamentarians to ensure that the National Security and Intelligence Review Agency would have the substantive authorities that it has now. Finally, they are seeking to delay and to obstruct the idea of a civilian review commission to look at the Canada Border Services Agency, for the first time ever, and of course to look at the RCMP, which we think is a good idea. Canadians would expect us to work collaboratively on that.

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Mr. Sébastien Lemire (Abitibi—Témiscamingue, BQ)

Jun/4/24 6:43:00 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I thank the minister for his interest in border services. However, it seems clear to me that the Canada Border Services Agency is experiencing a major governance problem. Therefore, in the context of today's debate, which is about implementing a new mechanism to address this governance problem, would it not have been a good idea to review the existing governance model and ensure that those responsible have the necessary skills to deal with the new complaint management mechanisms? We know that ArriveCAN was a disaster. The handling of stolen vehicles at the port of Montreal also raises many concerns. I would like to hear the minister's thoughts on the governance of the Canada Border Services Agency.

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Hon. Dominic LeBlanc

Jun/4/24 6:43:42 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, our colleague from Abitibi—Témiscamingue raises an important issue, namely the internal governance of the Canada Border Services Agency. The CBSA has gone through some difficult times, what with the Auditor General's report and the internal reviews of ArriveCAN. I have a great deal of trust in the current president of the CBSA, Erin O'Gorman. I got to know her when she was a senior official at the Treasury Board. She has a lot of experience, specifically in matters of governance. My discussions with her and the executive vice-president of the CBSA reassured me tremendously about their commitment to improving the governance of that organization. The idea of having a civilian-run independent commission to address this and deal with complaints is an important addition to the discussion.

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Mr. Kevin Lamoureux (Parliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons, Lib.)

Jun/4/24 6:45:02 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I look at the legislation as enabling additional public confidence in an institution that plays such an important role in many different ways. Our Canada border control officers, in general, do an outstanding job, and there has been a great deal of work, through the minister and the minister's staff, to bring it to the point where it is today. Unfortunately, with the legislative agenda, what we find is that the Conservative Party of Canada, better known as the “Reformers” inside the House, really do not want to have legislation that is good for Canadians ultimately passed, and that is really quite unfortunate. I am wondering if the minister can provide his thoughts in regards to how this legislation, once passed, would really add value in terms of public confidence in the system.

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Confidence

Hon. Dominic LeBlanc

Jun/4/24 6:46:00 p.m.
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Re: Bill C-20

Madam Speaker, I thank our colleague, the parliamentary secretary, for highlighting what surprises colleagues on our side of the House, in terms of the Conservatives' reticence to adopt legislation that would provide, for the first time, independent civilian oversight of the Canada Border Services Agency and that would strengthen the previous complaints commission process for the Royal Canadian Mounted Police. Our national security institutions do great work to protect Canadians, to serve Canadians and to ensure, in the case of the Canada Border Services Agency, that duties are collected appropriately by competent authorities. It is important for the Canadian economy, and it is important for the treasury of the Government of Canada. That work is very important, and it is done well. There is also a national security, a border security, element. All of these agencies benefit from independent, strengthened oversight to deal with complaints, to deal with, as my colleague, the New Democratic Party House leader, identified in the case of some union circumstances or employees. All of this should be important for members, in terms of providing the support for these agencies, and I hope Parliament will adopt this bill, Bill C-20.

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Mr. Peter Julian

Jun/4/24 6:47:24 p.m.
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Re: Bill C-20

Madam Speaker, the NDP fought hard to improve this bill, Bill C-20, to increase transparency and accountability and to ensure that there was more investigative power. There are many improvements to this bill. However, as we know, it came out of committee, and then promptly ran into the stone wall, which is the Conservative Party of Canada, that blocked dental care, pharmacare, the affordable housing provisions that the NDP has pushed the government to put into place and the improvements to the Competition Act. Of course, Conservatives do not accept the blame for having delayed this bill now for months because they blocked everything else before it. The disingenuous idea that somehow this bill, Bill C-20, can just make its way through the House of Commons when the Conservatives have blocked every single piece of legislation that helps the country and that helps their constituents, I think shows the extent to which Conservatives are willing to mislead the public. The reality is that Conservatives have been unwilling to pass this bill, despite all the benefits for Canada and for those who work for CBSA and the RCMP, which would ensure more accountability and transparency of those institutions and would ensure a way for the public to make complaints. With all those benefits in Bill C-20, why have Conservatives been blocking it for so long?

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Hon. Dominic LeBlanc

Jun/4/24 6:48:55 p.m.
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Re: Bill C-20

Madam Speaker, my colleague from New Westminster—Burnaby again identifies what, for us, was a very constructive and positive effort from our colleagues at committee to improve the legislation. As I said, the New Democratic Party was a very steady and constructive voice in bringing thoughtful amendments that, from our perspective, strengthened the legislation. The member identified, for example, the importance of the public having a process by which complaints could be adjudicated by competent authorities, the appointments process of members of the commission reflecting the diversity of our country and the appropriate role for this complaints review commission, with respect to the internal matters involving employees. These were all things the committee strengthened or improved in the legislative process. I too share my colleague's view of the disingenuous way in which the Conservatives now pretend that there is no urgency to pass this bill, Bill C-20, after they took every conceivable step to make sure that this legislation would not get to a vote. The good news is that we may be getting to that point this evening.

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Mr. Kelly McCauley

Jun/4/24 6:50:12 p.m.
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Re: Bill C-20

Madam Speaker, I have to laugh at the minister's comments about being disingenuous. He talked about strengthening oversight with this bill, Bill C-20, the importance of the appointments process and the appropriate role of the complaints process. I wonder if the minister made the exact same arguments to the Prime Minister and the rest of his cabinet before he voted to prorogue government in order to cover up for the WE scandal.

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Hon. Dominic LeBlanc

Jun/4/24 6:50:38 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, members, I hope, will agree that there is some irony in a member of the Conservative Party criticizing prorogation when its former leader, former Prime Minister Harper, prorogued Parliament to avoid a confidence vote that would have likely replaced his government. He had to have a one-hour wrangle with the Governor General to ask for that unconstitutional and unprecedented request. I thought the Conservatives were addicted to prorogation, particularly if it involves a confidence vote that might avoid their government being accountable to this very House. I certainly would not impute some impure motive on our colleague from Edmonton West, but I think he should be careful when he sees prorogation as essential to the survival of his former Conservative government.

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Mr. Mario Beaulieu (La Pointe-de-l'Île, BQ)

Jun/4/24 6:51:38 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, the Bloc Québécois is naturally in favour of this bill. I hope this will give citizens effective recourse. I heard about a lot of cases of abuse of power against people who wanted to be served in French, including at the Montreal airport. This seems to be done with impunity. There was even a university professor who was jailed for being a bit too insistent on being served in French. I am not sure what my—

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The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Carol Hughes)

Jun/4/24 6:52:11 p.m.
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The hon. minister.

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Hon. Dominic LeBlanc

Jun/4/24 6:52:16 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I thank our colleague from La Pointe-de-l'Île. What a beautiful name for a riding. I am a little envious of the name of his constituency. Our colleague raises an issue that should be of concern to everyone. I, too, am concerned. I fully share our colleague's concerns about the importance of having border services officers who can serve people in both official languages, whether at the Montreal airport or anywhere else in Canada. In every conversation I have, I obviously encourage other CBSA senior officials to ensure that the kind of situation described by my colleague does not happen. I would also like to thank the Bloc Québécois members for their very constructive support in moving this bill forward. I would be happy to make sure we resolve this kind of issue correctly.

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Ms. Leah Gazan (Winnipeg Centre, NDP)

Jun/4/24 6:53:28 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, it is very clear, certainly from the news, that there is a need for independent oversight. The National Inquiry into Missing and Murdered Indigenous Women and Girls called for systemic change, particularly relating to calls 9.1 to 9.11. It is not shocking to me. We know there is systemic racism in policing. We know it is not effective for police to police themselves. To the minister, why do you think the Conservatives are so against addressing systemic racism in both the CBSA and the RCMP, which has been highly reported, including at the United Nations?

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The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Carol Hughes)

Jun/4/24 6:54:22 p.m.
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I want to remind the hon. member that she is to address questions and comments through the Chair and not directly to the minister. The hon. minister.

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Hon. Dominic LeBlanc

Jun/4/24 6:54:30 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, the member identifies something that we have acknowledged: the presence of systemic racism in policing institutions and other governmental institutions. It is a concern that we share with her. Again, one of the constructive elements of the work done by colleagues at the committee, including the House leader of the New Democratic Party, was the ability to collect race-based data and to look at the issues around overrepresentation of racialized people and indigenous people in the criminal justice system. Sadly, in many cases, the entry point for many of these people in the criminal justice system is interactions with the police or conceivably the Canada Border Services Agency. That is why it is important that the appropriate people be appointed to this oversight group to ensure that exactly the kind of concern that our colleague from Winnipeg Centre raises is addressed at the highest levels and with the utmost vigour.

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Mr. Frank Caputo

Jun/4/24 6:55:55 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, it is always a pleasure to rise on behalf of the people of Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo. I just want to reiterate the point made by my colleague from Edmonton. He asked the minister whether he advised the Prime Minister in relation to this bill when prorogation occurred in the 43rd Parliament. The minister danced, weaved and dodged, and he would not answer the question. I will ask it again. Prior to the prorogation in the 43rd Parliament, did he advise the Prime Minister in relation to this bill, yes or no?

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