I’d like to thank the member from Nickel Belt for her excellent presentation about how it is wise and fiscally prudent to invest in community-based surgical centres. Not only did she highlight the safety and the continuity of care but also the better health outcomes. I would also like to thank the member for recognizing the great work of Dr. Abdel-Rahman Lawendy, the chief medical director of the Nazem Kadri Surgical Centre at London Health Sciences Centre.

Standard operating rooms are required for complex care, where there are six staff per room. They require a full set of sterilized instruments. It costs on average $469 per day, whereas these other ambulatory centres cost $172 per day. It’s 36% of the cost.

This government’s ideological adherence to the for-profit model—I wanted to ask the member, who is this government listening to, if it’s not listening to patients?

We already have. I have the Kensington Eye Institute not-for-profit. I have Dr. Sorgini. They already post their charges, and the charges vary quite a bit from one to the next. What costs $200 at Kensington costs $250 with Dr. Sorgini, and the list goes on.

It’s not because the extra fees are being posted that the relationship between the person who provides the care and the person who receives the care changes. The health providers have all the power. If, in order to have the surgery done on a fixed date, you need to buy one of those products, you will, because you don’t want to lose your driver’s licence. You don’t want to have to travel three times to Sudbury to have your surgery cancelled.

No, I will never support extra fees. Hospitals don’t charge extra fees. Care is based on need, not ability to pay.

Those people—you go on the website; they are here to lobby the government. They are lobbying me also, so I have no doubt that they are lobbying the government, and the government is listening. There are a lot of people closely tied to the Conservative government who stand to benefit by millions of dollars once Bill 60 goes forward, on the backs of sick people.

Sometimes when MPPs talk about health care and long-term care, they miss the great work being done in the community support services sector.

People want to age at home, and community support services help meet that need. Caregivers risk burnout and financial burden without these services. Some may even feel pressure to quit their job to look after a loved one. No one should feel forced to make this choice.

Community support services are cost-effective, personalized and help free up beds in hospitals and long-term care. Recently, I had the opportunity to meet with the Alzheimer Society, Cheshire Independent Living Services, St. Joe’s hospice and many more. Users of these services see a 43% decrease in avoidable ER visits. In addition, when community support services are available, hospital stay lengths are decreased more than 30%. Care at home costs $42 a day while long-term care is $126; in hospitals, at least $842. Saving $800 per day is pretty cost-effective. It’s literally 5% of the cost.

However, like other parts of our health care system, lack of funding means service reductions and staff are continually asked to do more with less. This sector, primarily made up of women, faces a variety of struggles, including the inability to hire and retain staff.

Ontarians want to be supported at home. I call upon this government to make the necessary investments in community support services so that people can stay where their heart is: at home with loved ones.

I always love when we have a chance to hear the member from Timiskaming–Cochrane’s debate here in the Legislature. I do like the fact that he brings a real-world perspective to some of this, being a farmer and having worked in that industry for many years prior to getting into politics.

I do want to touch on PAWS a little bit. I know that was something that you covered quite a bit in your debate. One of the pieces of this bill is to allow the crown to recoup costs for veterinary services that are incurred while an animal is under their care. I just wanted to get a little bit more of your thoughts on that and whether you think that might also have a secondary aspect to it, where it might actually deter people from doing things wrong or not taking proper care of their animals, to know that they would have to pay back those costs.