Hon. Marco E. L. Mendicino, P.C., M.P., Minister of Public Safety: Thank you, senator, nice to see you again in this chamber. I do recall my appearance from a year ago. I am more optimistic than you in the progress we have made around the creation of a foreign agent registry.

As you have seen, we have been conducting robust public consultations on how best to create that new legal instrument to promote transparency around what is legitimate diplomatic activity while at the same time deterring and ferreting out any foreign activities which go beyond the conventions of legitimate diplomacy and may spill over into foreign interference.

It is my sincere hope that as a result of the consultations in which I observed a strong consensus on the need for the creation of this bill that we are able to create it in a way that is consistent with the concerns that have been expressed to me by diaspora communities who are the targets of foreign interference and consistent with the principles of the Charter.

Tracing back to our first exchange, senator, I think we have made significant progress, and I believe that next year at this time we will have a registry in place.

Hon. Kim Pate: Welcome, minister. Recently, you reiterated your laudable support for the automatic expungement of criminal records and the implementation of such a model.

Could you please update us on the progress of your work to implement an automated pardon system, including how you’re considering: one, historical convictions, for instance soliciting, which disproportionately impacts women and which is currently missing from the list of historical convictions; and two, the impacts and contributions of records to the continued overrepresentation in our criminal, legal and prison systems of the poor, those with disabling mental health issues and racialized people, especially Indigenous women who now make up 50% of the federal prison population, many of whom have also been convicted of violent offences largely in response to their experiences of violence?

Hon. Marco E. L. Mendicino, P.C., M.P., Minister of Public Safety: First of all, I want to say that I share your concerns. Yes, it is very difficult time for the policing community. I attended the funerals of all those who lost their lives in the line of duty.

I am really touched by their sacrifice; it is what motivates both me and the government. In my opinion, the only way we can reduce gun violence is with a comprehensive plan that includes three pillars. The first consists in strong borders, and we have already invested $450 million in that. The second is a prevention strategy, and we are investing $250 million to build community services in order to address social determinants. And finally, the third consists in strong laws, like Bill C-21, that will facilitate the implementation of a national ban on assault weapons.

I hope you, and all the senators, will take advantage of the technical briefing on this subject tomorrow.

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Hon. Denise Batters: Minister, with every avenue your government employs to fix this Beijing interference scandal, all roads lead to the Trudeau Foundation. The Prime Minister chose Morris Rosenberg to report on foreign election interference. He was the Trudeau Foundation CEO at the time of the infamous Beijing donation. His conclusion? Nothing to see here.

The Trudeau Foundation was invisible in Special Rapporteur David Johnston’s 55-page report. Johnston, himself a Trudeau Foundation member, concluded he’d replace the public inquiry Canadians want with more “Special Rapporteuring.” To counter questions about his close ties to PM Trudeau, Johnston sought an independent legal opinion from another Trudeau Foundation alumnus, Frank Iacobucci. And the two security committees tasked with this scandal? NSIRA has two Trudeau Foundation alumni, including the chair, while the lone senator on NSICOP is also a Trudeau Foundation alumnus.

Given this pattern, why should Canadians trust they will get the answers they deserve on this shocking interference scandal?

Hon. Andrew Cardozo: Thank you, Minister Mendicino. Welcome to the Senate. Thank you for being here to answer our questions.

My question is with regard to foreign interference. I want to suggest a third option. There are two options that are being discussed publicly, the public inquiry and certainly the process that Mr. Johnston has suggested. But I think each has its strengths and weaknesses, and certainly we have a bit of an impasse over in your chamber.

I would like to suggest a third option that would combine the two, which would look at a public inquiry led by a judge but still have an active role for NSICOP and NSIRA to review the materials at the beginning and at the end of such a process.

I think it’s also important for the inquiry to look at interference of all kinds, be it political, economic or social, and from all countries. It’s a problem that has existed for a while. Would you consider such a third option at this point?

Hon. Jean-Guy Dagenais: In the last six months, nine police officers have been killed in the line of duty in Canada. None of these murders could have been prevented by the nature or the content of your Bill C-21. The violence responsible for the many shootings across the country in no way relates to the restrictions in your bill. These are criminals using unregistered firearms to kill.

When the violence isn’t linked to organized crime, the murders are being committed by people suffering from mental illness who are out on the streets when they should be in institutions.

If you take the time, as I have, to examine the origins of the violence, don’t you find it discouraging to see how much time public servants are spending trying to classify firearms rather than looking for immediate solutions to this violence? I’m talking about judicial remedies, law enforcement and medical solutions.

Hon. Marco E. L. Mendicino, P.C., M.P., Minister of Public Safety: Thank you for the question, senator.

The road to reconciliation is truly challenging. We have a plan founded on relationships with Indigenous communities and based on good faith. I think we need to continue with a plan of engagement that will result in meaningful initiatives.

Take, for example, the Aboriginal Community Safety Planning Initiative. We have already announced the reopening of Indigenous police services in the James Smith Cree Nation in Nunavut and in the Siksika Nation in Alberta, so there are precedents on which we can build future initiatives.

The government also intends to introduce a new bill to recognize that Indigenous police services are an essential service, just as they are in non-Indigenous communities. I am working with Indigenous leaders on that.

Hon. Marco E. L. Mendicino, P.C., M.P., Minister of Public Safety: Thank you very much for the thoughtful question, senator. I would begin by underlining that foreign interference impacts every aspect of life: our economy, our democratic institutions — including some of the profoundly concerning reports that we’ve heard around parliamentarians — and, equally, communities themselves. The degree to which we are seeing transnational repression impact for the purposes of discouraging members of the communities from fully participating in their communities is one of the singular motivations that has seen us create new authorities and new mechanisms of transparency.

It is that last value that I want to take a quick moment to expand on. Even as the debate continues on what the best path forward is, for me, and based on the conversations that I have had with Canadians, we have to put them at the centre of this exercise. I believe that by having public hearings that engage Canadians directly and thoughtfully on the tools we need to equip our establishment with to protect ourselves from foreign interference is the way to refine these tools to ensure we are dealing with and reducing foreign interference and building the confidence of Canadians in our institutions.

Hon. Marco E. L. Mendicino, P.C., M.P., Minister of Public Safety: Canadians can trust that they will get the answers they deserve on foreign interference because it is our government that has created the NSICOP and NSIRA. It is our government that has appointed a Special Rapporteur to shine a light on the way in which this government is dealing with and combatting foreign interference.

The trouble that I have with the Conservative Party of Canada’s position on this issue is that while we have offered time and again the Leader of the Conservative Party of Canada, Pierre Poilievre, an opportunity to be briefed at the highest classified levels, thus far, he has refused to take the briefing. Our suggestion is that he take the briefing so he can be equipped with the information he needs to have a thoughtful conversation about how we can fight foreign interference together.

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Hon. Claude Carignan: Minister, in 2018, you legalized the use of cannabis. Then just about everything you were told would happen did happen. The black market still exists, it is competing with the legal distribution network and consumption among youth has increased.

Studies show that one third of Canadians surveyed who have used cannabis in the past year reported having driven while under the influence of the drug. There were 541 children hospitalized across the country for cannabis poisoning between January and September 2021. You were warned about all these types of incidents.

The Competition Bureau of Canada now wants to stimulate consumption, foster innovation and ask for higher THC limits.

Hon. Marco E. L. Mendicino, P.C., M.P., Minister of Public Safety: Thank you for the question, senator. It has to be as quickly as possible, but it has to be in the right way. That is the enduring lesson of reconciliation. I assure you that we have been working around the clock with Indigenous leaders, including Regional Chief Teegee and Regional Chief Picard, both of whom sit on the joint task force for Indigenous policing with the Assembly of First Nations, or AFN, but equally with rights holders and title holders directly in their communities, to ensure that we are building this legislation in a manner that is consistent with the principles of co-development.

In the meantime, we have allocated a historic level of funding under the First Nations and Inuit Policing Program, which we are rolling out at an accelerated rate — $860 million. This is resulting in concrete progress, like the announcements we have made with Siksika Nation, with James Smith Cree Nation and in Nunavut, as well as the work we are doing in the Mohawk territory, including in Akwesasne, where just last week we made another global announcement of $12.1 million in partnership with Chief Abram Benedict. That is the proof that we are making progress, but we still have work to do on the legislation; we are committed to doing it.

[Translation]

Hon. Yuen Pau Woo: Good afternoon, minister. The so-called Montreal police stations that Senator Housakos has maligned is the Service à la Famille Chinoise du Grand Montréal, an organization that has been providing community services to Chinese Canadians in Montreal for nearly 50 years. You have said the so-called police station at the centre has been shut down, but you have not provided any information about when it operated, what it did, what was objectionable about what it did, who was involved and, most importantly, how the centre can recognize such activity so that it does not happen again. Minister, when will you clear the good name of the Service à la Famille Chinoise du Grand Montréal so they can continue to do the good work they have been doing for nearly 50 years?

Hon. Marty Klyne: Minister, your mandate letter includes continued work with First Nations partners to co-develop a legislative framework for First Nations policing, and to continue to engage with the Inuit and Métis on policing matters.

You previously indicated your hope to table such legislation in fall 2022. However, last month, The Canadian Press reported uncertainty about when — and if — the government will table a First Nations policing bill this year, including to recognize First Nations policing as an essential service. I note that Budget 2021 made significant funding commitments for the co-development process. Minister, in terms of delivering the subject legislation, when can Canadians expect the bill’s introduction?

Hon. Marco E. L. Mendicino, P.C., M.P., Minister of Public Safety: Yes, Senator, I’m sure that when the bill comes into force it will save lives. A national freeze on handguns will prevent other shooting tragedies. Handguns are the type of guns used in the vast majority of homicides. The statistics prove it. A national freeze on handguns will reduce handgun violence.

We also need to boost the resources at the Canada Border Services Agency. The government is working on that. Finally, we also need to address the problem at the source through a prevention plan in partnership with local organizations that understand the situation better than we do in this chamber and better than any parliamentarian. They are the ones who understand the risks on the ground. Thanks to this initiative, we could prevent incidents of violence in the future.

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Hon. Marco E. L. Mendicino, P.C., M.P., Minister of Public Safety: That was, perhaps, one of the most educational and enriching experiences that I have had as the Minister of Public Safety — and as someone who comes from the big city of Toronto. I was able to go to the Yukon and take a trip on the Dawson Overland Trail with people who are gun owners — people who are not only engaging in a hobby because, for them, this is a pastime. It’s part of the fabric of who they are.

I was there to see how they carry out this pastime in a way that is safe and secure, as well as how they use legal firearms to hunt, trap and, in some cases with First Nations communities, protect themselves from the wildlife that is there. I assured them that Bill C-21 is not about targeting law-abiding gun owners, as we often hear by the Conservative Party, but rather going after the AR-15-style firearms that have been used and could be used again in the future in mass shootings.

As you know, the Mass Casualty Commission from Nova Scotia called on our government to strengthen the national ban against those AR-15-style firearms. We took that action, and we did it with a broad consensus of three of the four major recognized parties in the House of Commons, but also in a way that is respectful of life in the North. That will continue to be the way in which we do this work.

[Translation]

Hon. Marco E. L. Mendicino, P.C., M.P., Minister of Public Safety: I want to thank you, senator, for the question. The first and most important principle I would underline is that — and I hope this is a sentiment that we all share — any foreign interference should be both held accountable and condemned, as it is contrary to the Canadian national interest. Our government has put into place the tools that are necessary to deal with that scourge as it becomes increasingly pervasive and complex.

My job as the Minister of Public Safety is to advocate for the new tools that our security establishment is advocating for, as well as ensure that we bring along Canadians who may be marginalized or stereotyped — because it is they who, at times, have been the victims of foreign interference. I want to assure you, as I have in the past, that we will continue to have that dialogue going forward.

In regard to the so-called police stations and the foreign interference activities that have been reported in relation to them, as you know, the RCMP has made public statements that they have disrupted those activities in the past. In any ongoing investigations going forward, questions should be directed to them because they are conducting those operations in a manner that is independent from the elected government — consistent with constitutional principles.

Hon. Jean-Guy Dagenais Minister, I want to come back to Bill C-21. Do you think it will prevent crimes committed by street gangs in Vancouver, Toronto or Montreal, when the bill will simply hurt law-abiding citizens who take the time to register their firearms?

Hon. Pat Duncan: Minister Mendicino, thank you for your attendance today. In January, you travelled to the Yukon, and met with the Canadian Rangers, the Yukon Fish and Game Association and gun owners, as well as the Yukon government and the First Nations government. You also went out on the land and stated to the Yukon media that you were “able to experience . . . how firearms are used safely and responsibly.” You concluded your quote to the local media by saying that you learned a lot.

Minister, in my efforts as the senator representing my region, would you tell me how this learning experience — what you heard from Yukoners — is reflected in Bill C-21?

Hon. Marco E. L. Mendicino, P.C., M.P., Minister of Public Safety: Madam Speaker, I share the honourable senator’s concerns about the challenges that individuals face when dealing with mental health and substance use issues, including drugs.

In the context of the federal government’s approach, the work being done by Carolyn Bennett, Minister of Mental Health and Addictions, focuses on public health and mental health services to help those who need it.

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