44th Parl. 1st Sess.
June 13, 2023 10:00AM
- Jun/13/23 11:58:21 a.m.
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Mr. Speaker, my first speech in this House involved a compliment to the hon. member for the great work that she has done in the Downtown Eastside in representing a constituency that has a lot of challenges. I do not disagree with anything that she said, but I wanted to introduce two aspects and get a reaction to them.
One is the zoning and the difficulties that people have getting cities to actually approve developments. Second is the reticence of municipal governments to increase property taxes on existing residents, which leads to the pilling on of development cost charges on new buildings that only serve to jack up the price for people who are buying those units.
Can she comment on both of those?
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- Jun/13/23 7:03:53 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague, who sits very close to me, for his wonderful speech this evening.
I believe the hybrid Parliament is a good thing, but I am not in favour of its being abused by members here in the House. It should be available, yes, for somebody who needs it. As the member said, he had surgery earlier this year and was able to vote on the app. I had surgery as well, on February 14, actually, and shovelled snow two days later.
However, it is a privilege and an honour to be able sit and stand in this House as one of 338 people. I spend time here even when I am not on House duty. I love sitting in the House and having people sit around me instead of being in the office in my constituency with nobody. Does the member agree that it is a good policy to have, but it should not be allowed to be abused? People who can be here should be here.
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- Jun/13/23 10:21:51 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, this was the argument that was presented by some who came before the procedure and House affairs committee, but I will just refer to another couple of the tweets from her former colleague, the Hon. Wayne Easter, who has spent years in this place.
He said, “If you don’t want to work in Ottawa during the parliamentary sessions, don’t run to be an MP.”
It seems like harsh language, but I will go back to the comments that I have made before. I have watched decisions made that I consider to be absolutely damaging to the interests of this country because MPs were operating in individual silos on Zoom in their constituency offices, with a general inability to reflect with each other about the decisions being made in this place.
I will go back to 15 years prior, to when I first witnessed hybrid. I had never seen such disastrous decisions being made, because when we were all here and we were all together, we had to work together and we made better decisions.
It is the ideas that come together, the bubbling up through the discussions that we have in this place that make this country great.
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- Jun/13/23 10:54:41 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, my colleague talked about adapting. I totally agree that we have to adapt on a daily basis.
On the other hand, neither Quebec nor any other province has a hybrid legislature. I would like it if he could name two or three countries in the world that operate in hybrid mode.
Some MPs are giving the excuse that their constituency is remote. My colleague's riding, Lac-Saint-Jean, is a seven-hour drive away. The ridings of MPs from British Columbia are a six-hour flight away. Where is the logic?
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Madam Speaker, as always, it is an immense privilege to be able to join the debate here tonight and bring the perspective of my constituents of Kings—Hants. To those who are still watching at home as we approach 11 o'clock eastern time, we are talking today about amending the Standing Orders.
The Standing Orders are the guidelines or rules of how Parliament actually operates. Back when I was elected in this place, in 2019, I was a bright-eyed and bushy-tailed new member of Parliament. I had about 12 weeks. The member for Kingston and the Islands has some concern about the way I framed that.
However, as a new member of Parliament, I was here, I was excited and I was finding my way around this place. Then, of course, the pandemic came. I never had the chance to come back in person until after the 2021 election. There was a large period of uncertainty. I remember having conversations with colleagues in March 2020, saying that we were going to go home for a couple of weeks and suspecting we would be back in April. That is not how it played out. Obviously we did not know the severity of what we were dealing with.
When I think back to the 43rd Parliament, had we not adopted some of these provisions, I would not have had the ability to bring my voice to the institution that is the House of Commons and that is Parliament. It also gave reflection for all 338 members of Parliament in this place about how we could modernize the tools to make sure that we are effective representatives for our constituents here in this place.
However, the conversation has to start with, what is the role of a member of Parliament? What do our constituents expect us to do? If I was to go survey the doorsteps in Kings—Hants, many would not necessarily know exactly what I do in Ottawa every day. They would know that I speak in this place at certain times. They may know that I am part of committees. They do not necessarily know the full scope.
We certainly try to share information and talk about the work I am doing in a legislative sense, the priorities I am trying to encourage the government to take up, what the government is taking on, but there is a lot that goes into being a member of Parliament. Part of it is visibility. I represent a rural riding of nearly 5,000 square kilometres. Part of my role is being visible in my riding to have the conversations with my constituents so I can bring their perspective back to this place.
There are parts of my riding that, frankly, it is very difficult to get to in a given calendar year. We sit in Parliament six months a year. I do not begrudge that reality. I think it is good. It is important that we have robust debate, that we have a democratic process through committees and through legislative means, but the reality is, with the size of the riding that I have, it is difficult to do.
When we look at what the government House leader has tabled as a permanent change to the Standing Orders, it allows us to function, similar to what we have done post-pandemic, which is to allow there to be a virtual option for members of Parliament to use.
I remember a year ago when we were having this conversation about the extension within a year, there were certainly concerns from the opposition bench about ministerial accountability and about making sure that members of Parliament are in this place. What I have observed in that year since then is, by and large, members of Parliament are here in the House. There are certain exceptions.
We saw the member for Labrador, for example. She had a very moving S.O. 31 today. She had to go through a really difficult health challenge. We are proud of what she has done. Rightfully so, she took some time away from her role as a member of Parliament, but she would have had the ability to participate notwithstanding that her health required her to be in another part of the country. She could not have physically been in this place.
We can look at the ways we could use the tools available to us. The member for Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan talked about the virtual voting tool. I agree with it. I have used it very sparingly, but there have been two instances in the last year where I have chosen to use the virtual option as a way to be able to participate in this place.
Madam Speaker, I believe you were at the national caucus last year in New Brunswick and would know that part of the bargain with my wife, for me to join this place, was that we had to get a Bernese mountain dog. Sadly, at Christmastime 2022, we found out that our Bernese mountain dog had developed bone cancer. He sadly passed away early in 2023, around late February, early March.
I ended up going home to spend time with my wife. I know it is not a child, but he was our fur baby, he was our guy. That same day that we were putting our dog down, Bill C-234, which is a really important piece of legislation that is now before the Senate, was up for debate. I went home to be with my family. I had the opportunity to still participate and give my perspective as the member of Parliament for Kings—Hants and to bring the perspective of my constituents to this place because of those virtual tools. I would not have had that ability had these rules not been in place.
When we look at the whole, in terms of the balance between the work that members of Parliament have to do in Ottawa in terms of their legislative function in the House and in committees versus the role of being back there and in front of constituents, hearing the concerns and driving certain initiatives, whether on projects or case files, constituents want to see us at home. They want to see us being able to make things happen for our community. I do not think they are necessarily troubled if on an odd occasion a member of Parliament will use these tools.
Therefore, I am in support of what the government House leader has put forward. What this House could consider in the days ahead is if we are concerned, whether the opposition or a majority of members of Parliament, about the use of these tools and whether they are being used in a way that is not bringing us together in the House in the way that it should. Look, it is pretty lively in any given question period when I sit in here. There is usually a pretty good quorum. There may be a few seats of members of Parliament who are not there, but even before these rules were in place there would have been instances where members of Parliament were travelling and were not able to be in the House physically.
On the whole, there is merit to what is being discussed. It is a way for members of Parliament to be able to balance their rigid duties here in the House but also make sure that they are being true and honest, and not only to the constituency concerns but to family concerns.
I had the opportunity to read Andrew Coyne's article in The Globe and Mail. Of course, he had suggested that this is not a great step, moving forward. My concern with his article is that he suggests that members of Parliament do not want to show up in this place.
I want to be here because I agree with some of the comments that have been made tonight. We cannot replicate the ability to participate in a human-to-human interaction here in the House, to be able to go over and talk to a colleague across the way and to be able to pull aside a minister and have a conversation on something that matters. That still matters and if one wants to be an effective member of Parliament they will show up to this place. If they choose to use the virtual tools in a way that is not the way that they should be used, in terms of their never showing up to this place, well the opposition, the media and their own constituents will hold them to account and start asking questions as to why they are not in this place. Absent a reasonable excuse as to why a member may be using those, there are enough mechanisms for us to hold members of Parliament to account and the fact that they are here.
Again, one was a family issue. The other was that I had a grandmother who was ill. Thankfully, she has come through that period. I wanted to go home. I wanted to be there in that moment. I would have not have had the opportunity to balance my parliamentary duties and also be a good grandson at that time. Let us not have this dichotomy where we suggest the only way to be a good member of Parliament is that we have to be physically in Ottawa for every single thing that we do in a parliamentary sense.
The last thing I want to address is the provision that it would actually require committee chairs to chair the committee in person. I fundamentally agree with this. I have the privilege of serving as the chair of the House of Commons Standing Committee on Agriculture and Agri-Food. Any time I cannot be in Ottawa, I give way to my vice-chair, the hon. member for Foothills, because I know at the end of the day it is better to conduct a meeting when we can actually work alongside our clerk. There are a number of challenges in trying to be able to read a room and in trying to be able to facilitate a meeting when we are thousands of miles away. That is a reasonable compromise.
My last suggestion would be that as we move forward in this place and we start to identify issues, we can come back and address them, similar to what was done on the committee chair piece and their being in the room. That is a reasonable compromise. Let us move forward. Let us continue to drive important changes to how our Parliament works.
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- Jun/13/23 11:13:37 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, as I begin this debate tonight, I will state that this is not an easy job to do. I will be the first to acknowledge that. I love what I do, and I think every member in this place loves what they do. They have a passion, energy and desire to build a better country.
I have been here three and a half years, and like many members, a few who have spoken tonight, I am from the class of 2019. We had a few months of normalcy after the 2019 election. We figured out where the offices and washrooms were. We figured out how things ran here. Then the world changed, both in what we talked about in policy with the pandemic and in how we operated here.
There are many different facets to the role we have as members of Parliament. I am thinking of the work we do here in the chamber, at committee and back in our constituency offices on case files. We are present in the community at riding and community events and get feedback. Of course, now that we are out of the pandemic, we are getting to different parts of the country to get the message out from our caucuses and leaders and so forth. However, I will say this. Despite the changes in 2019, we are now, at this point, in this debate tonight, out of the pandemic and back to what I would say is a semblance of normalcy.
I knew what I was signing up for in 2019 when I took this job. Every member of Parliament has challenges in the work they do here on the Hill. There is no denial there. There are family responsibilities, circumstances that change and travel as well. I often chuckle that I have a pretty easy commute, being from eastern Ontario, to get back home. It is about an hour and 10 minutes to my riding.
I consider myself very fortunate. For me, the member next door in Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes and members in the national capital region, it is a blessing to get home quickly. It can also be a curse some days, because constituents know I can go back for a passport clinic, a community event or whatever it may be. However, all that said, given the point in time we are at now, when we are talking about the strengthening and protection of our democracy and its integrity and all aspects of that, the debate we are having tonight is fundamentally important to getting the basic stuff right.
I am in favour of change. Change naturally happens. I remember being a mayor at the municipal level and having to navigate a lot of that. It is not always easy to do. However, sometimes there is change for the sake of doing something, and sometimes change goes too far.
As I was preparing my comments for the debate tonight, I thought of the words of a colleague who is no longer in the House, Wayne Easter. The former member for Malpeque had a great comment on Twitter this week: “Let me put it this way: If you don't want to work in Ottawa during the Parliamentary sessions—don't run to be an MP. A hybrid Parliament made sense during Covid but it should never be permanent. I strongly oppose govt's move to make it permanent.” I could not agree more with what Mr. Easter said on that point, and I am laughing when thinking of his Zoom discussions with the member for Carleton, the leader of our party, at the finance committee. They were certainly navigating some very interesting times.
As I share my time tonight with my colleague from Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, I am reflecting, in a sense, on certain provisions from our side of the aisle. As we have said in our dissenting reports and talked about at committee, some aspects can stay. Electronic voting is an example of that. How we can make that work could be open for discussion, as an example.
However, the idea is to be here on the floor of the House of Commons, to travel here and speak on behalf of, in my case, the people of Stormont—Dundas—South Glengarry from the perspectives of my riding, my community and my personal lived experience, whatever the benefit may be. That needs to happen in person.
I have seen things I take for granted. In the last few months, we have gotten traffic back in our caucus meetings, on the floor of the House, in committee and, yes, in the hallways for the networking and different connections we do at different times of the day. There is a value to being in person. It adds to our democracy; it does not take it away.
When we talk about these things, like making permanent the idea that somebody can Zoom in from their home or from their basement, I think we are at a point now where we can be compassionate. We can make changes to help adapt to difficult family situations and circumstances. I think the whips in our parties have given better flexibility over the course of the last couple of years to recognize personal and professional needs where need be. We can keep the core foundation of what we are talking about here.
I always joke that we are not normal. Most Canadians watching this would ask what the heck a standing order is. We are talking about the fundamental rules of how this House operates, and I think a way to describe them is they are the character, the tone and the nature of the way we do our business. I am very concerned that we are making Zoom aspects permanent so that people will be able to Zoom in for all of this.
Another part that is very concerning is the manner in which these changes are being made, the magnitude of these changes given our normal traditions here in the House and the way we have gone about this generally, with unanimous consent by all parties. We have this motion supported by the Liberals and the NDP. The Conservatives have raised some serious concerns in wanting a difference and the Bloc Québécois has done the same.
I cannot say it was for the entire Canadian history and our entire tenure of Parliament, but for the overwhelming majority of the time, changes to the Standing Orders and the rules that govern the House have been done by unanimous consent, by all parties giving and taking, figuring things out, throwing things at the wall, seeing what they can find a consensus on and making changes. Those changes, I think, have been for the better over the course of time, and this has been the best way to build confidence from Parliament to Parliament on these core essential functions.
One thing we have in here is a change to have committee chairs in person. I think that would end a lot of the chaos that happens in certain committees. With all due respect, I am thinking of numerous times at the heritage committee that we watched a natural technological filibuster of checking headsets, the chair not knowing what is happening with the committee clerk in the room and somebody calling a point of order. Consider the amount of time lost in a two-hour committee. Members of Parliament here talk about the efficient use of time. Our clerks are there. The interpreters are there. The IT team is there. The amount of time that was lost is probably into the hours over the course of the last couple of years simply because the chair was not in the room.
The fact that this is changing is a step in the right direction, but it does not go far enough. We talked about having the appropriate resources. When having these Zoom capabilities and all of these things going on, the resources are not backing them up.
I have heard several times tonight members of the government say, well, these are all things that could be adjusted and talked about. They should be done in the amendments to the Standing Orders. These things should be figured out now, these guardrails or barriers, to make sure we have protections so that committees can run when a majority of members of Parliament want to meet and they have work to get done, bills to go through, studies to do and witnesses to hear from. Because of a lack of resources, we are shutting things down.
That, still two years in, has been acknowledged many times. In all fairness, it is often to the benefit of the government. If something gets contentious and they are starting to negotiate which committee gets cancelled, it is not fair and it is not balanced. To colleagues who say that those are things we could have a conversation about, I would say these things should have been settled and done the way they have been done in parliamentary tradition in this country for many generations: all parties coming to unanimous consent, unanimous agreement, on how we can get to that.
Another thing we talk about is that there are some other tools already here that could be used more. If an absence is requested, there are pairing opportunities. There are leaves that can happen. There are tools. We have made a lot of advances here in recognizing the diverse geography of the country. As we have had more parents, different age groups and different circumstances, we have enhanced child care options and added designated travellers. All of these things were done to help make our work better and function better.
Tonight, as I wrap up, I think of my comments about these amendments to the Standing Orders. There was a time and a place for Zoom, but now is the time to get back in person. Our jobs are unique. It is an honour and a privilege to be one of only a few hundred members of Parliament in this country. When we speak for our constituents, there is no reason why that should not be done on the floor of the House of Commons. I think of the United Kingdom. I think of the United States. I think of many other countries' parliamentary structures that are similar, like Congress. They are back in person. They are doing the work. They are making it work.
Canadians expect us to get back to work in person and get the job done. As our leader likes to say, we need to bring it home.
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