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Ms. Heather McPherson (Edmonton Strathcona, NDP)

Dec/7/23 3:41:50 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I have just joined the debate for the last few minutes, listening to my colleague speak, and I heard my friend from southern Alberta, the province I am from, speaking about irrigation and the need for it. I have to say that the carbon levy is supposed to be part of a more comprehensive climate change strategy. I, like the member from Medicine Hat, will question whether this has been enough from the current Liberal government, because we have not seen from the government real action on climate change that has reduced emissions. The member brought up the idea that we need to deal with irrigation. Alberta has just had the driest November in a century because of the impacts of climate change. This is the same province that now has a Conservative government trying to coal mine the Rocky Mountains, which would destroy the irrigation from the Oldman River for southern Alberta. The Conservatives do not want to deal with the climate change aspect, which we have to deal with if we are going to be working with farmers. I would like my colleague from the Liberal Party to perhaps comment on the fact that the Liberals have not been able to reduce greenhouse gas emissions at all, and the fact that the Conservatives will not even admit there is a problem.

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Mr. Mark Gerretsen

Dec/7/23 3:43:09 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, there is a provincial Conservative government in Alberta that also put a moratorium on renewable energy projects. Can people imagine, in the year 2023, when the entire world is moving toward renewable energy, that a provincial government would put a moratorium on the innovation and the progress of where the world is moving to? That is not going to benefit Alberta in the long run. It might help a bit in the short run for a little political gain, but it is not going to help anybody in the long run. With respect to the member's question about meeting targets, I would much rather have very ambitious targets and not quite achieve them than have some lofty goals that are not realistic or that are overly easy to achieve. It is extremely important that when we do set these goals, we set them in a way that allows us to actually strive for something. I recognize that we are on target to meet our 2026 goals, and we are certainly on target to meet the 2030 goals, but I know that the member knows, because she cares about the environment so much, that this is not the kind of thing we accomplish overnight. We are talking about societal and cultural changes in the way that people behave in terms of everyday life. It is extremely difficult to encourage people to change behaviour when there is a political party in here, the Conservative Party of Canada, the opposition, that is actively doing the other thing and telling people, “No, no, what you are doing by burning fossil fuels is totally fine; keep doing this because, do not worry, we will get rid of this if we get elected.”

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Mr. Vance Badawey (Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Transport, Lib.)

Dec/7/23 3:45:04 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, as global market forces and inflation continue to hit Canadians, too many families are feeling the pressure of their monthly bills. Already, the Government of Canada has taken action on affordable child care, home retrofits, grocery prices and more. Now, we are taking an ambitious next step with a new energy affordability package. Can the member speak about energy affordability measures and what they include as we move forward with the package?

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Mr. Mark Gerretsen

Dec/7/23 3:45:37 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, we are aware that, certainly while we go through this transition, energy is going to be a struggle for Canadians. That is why we are trying to work with Canadians to give them the resources and the tools they need to be able to transition away, in particular, from the very expensive fossil-fuel-based forms of energy that create a lot of carbon emissions and, as a result, the tax. That is why we are encouraging people to move toward heat pumps, for example, by giving rebates and giving incentives to do that. We will continue to invest in programs like that.

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Ms. Monique Pauzé (Repentigny, BQ)

Dec/7/23 3:46:22 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, my colleague spoke at length about the positives of the carbon tax. However, the government itself has undermined its own policy, notably with its recent decision regarding heating oil in the Atlantic provinces. Is the government surprised that the Conservatives are now calling for this exemption to be extended to other target groups? I, for one, am not surprised at all.

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Carbon

Mr. Mark Gerretsen

Dec/7/23 3:46:55 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, the premise of the question is wrong. The member is suggesting that it was just for Atlantic provinces. It is not. The carve-out for home heating with oil is across the entire country. In my province of Ontario, there are twice as many people who use oil as in Atlantic Canada. I will say, though, that I believe that this is not the case in Quebec, because Quebec actually has a very ambitious program to get off fossil fuels; one will not be not allowed to build a new house there, as of the end of this year, or even to renovate and replace one's heating system, with a fossil-fuel-based appliance. Those are the kinds of measures we need in this country. It becomes very difficult to do that when we are fighting against an opposition that does not even believe we have a problem.

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Quebec
Fuels

Mr. Colin Carrie (Oshawa, CPC)

Dec/7/23 3:47:51 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I was a little concerned about the partisanship of my colleague's speech. The reason this is being brought forward is that Canadians right now are suffering. They are in a lot of pain. My colleague just admitted that Canadians will struggle when they have to use another form of energy. His colleague, my neighbour from Whitby, admitted last year that they knew that going to net zero is going to cause a lot of pain, and now we are going to get a quadrupling of the carbon tax. Could the member please let us know whether there are further policies that are in the pipe that will cause more pain and difficulty, such that Canadians will not be able to pay for a roof over their head and for food to feed their children?

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Mr. Mark Gerretsen

Dec/7/23 3:48:40 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, did members hear that? The member did again literally what I complained about in my entire speech. He said that the price on pollution is going to quadruple, but what did he forget to include? The rebate is going to quadruple, and 94% of Canadians get back more than they put in. The member refuses to stand up stand up and say that. Why will he not? It is the reality. Even if one makes $250,000 a year, 55% of Canadian households that make $250,000 a year still get more back than they put in. Why will he not say that when he stands up? It is because it does not feed his ultrapartisan talking points that the member for Carleton gave him.

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Mr. Robert Kitchen (Souris—Moose Mountain, CPC)

Dec/7/23 3:49:36 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I will be sharing my time with the member for Medicine Hat—Cardston—Warner. I am very grateful to have an opportunity to speak to today's opposition day motion, because it is an issue that has been affecting the constituents in Souris—Moose Mountain significantly since the Liberal government came into power. Time and time again, the Prime Minister has made it clear that he does not support Canadian agriculture producers or care about their livelihoods. Nothing has made this more obvious than his refusal to remove the carbon tax from farmers. Since the Liberals do not seem to have any understanding whatsoever of the importance of agriculture, not just for Saskatchewan but for all of Canada, I would like to paint a little picture for them. Saskatchewan farms account for the biggest share of Canada's total farm area, at 39.2%, to be precise. It is among the world's largest exporters of various field crops, such as canola, and it leads the country in the cultivation of cereal grains, oilseeds and pulses. This means that, in many instances, when people put food on the table for themselves and their families, they can thank a farmer from Saskatchewan for producing it. In fact, I was speaking with the French ambassador to Canada on Tuesday. He told me that France, which happens to be a world leader in mustard, is extremely dependent on Saskatchewan's mustard seed crop, especially when we have droughts and the crop is poor. With 66.9% of Saskatchewan's total farm area being made up of cropland, which is more than two-fifths of Canada's total cropland, it is commonly called the breadbasket of Canada. Even the Statistics Canada website uses this phrase, so the federal government must be aware of what our farmers do to feed Canada and the world, as well as the benefits they bring to our country's economy. Why the government chooses to punish the very same farmers who work tirelessly, day in and day out, to bring the highest-quality produce from the farm to the table, I personally cannot understand. Farming is not an easy lifestyle. The days are long, with farmers getting up before sunrise and finishing their workday in the dark. They are at the mercy of nature, and as we all know in the House, the weather in Canada does not always co-operate with our wants and needs. Still, our farmers persevere, because they are dedicated to their work; they are willing to make sacrifices in order to get the job done. The least we can do is support them, yet the Liberals choose instead to tax them at every turn and make their lives harder by quadrupling the carbon tax on their input costs. This will only increase the cost of food for Canadians. Food insecurity is a real issue in Canada right now, and it is something that I have been concerned about for a number of years under the mismanagement of the Liberal government. According to Food Banks Canada, there were nearly two million visits to food banks in one month back in March 2023, an increase of 79% from 2019. This is an alarming statistic, especially when we factor in the Liberals' inability to control inflation and the cost of living crisis that so many Canadians are currently facing. From 2021 to 2022, the number of families who were food insecure increased by more than 12%, yet the Liberals are still forcing these very same families to pay a carbon tax on just about everything they buy. In fact, a new report that came out today shows that a family of four will pay $700 more next year on groceries; that is on top of the $1,065 extra that they paid this year. For many families, that amount of money is the difference between being able to pay the rent or keep the heat on for the winter and not being able to do so. Projections show that, in 2024, there will be a 2.5% to 4.5% increase in food prices, with meat, vegetables and bakery items rising from 5% to 7%. Because of these rapidly rising prices, Canadians across the country are reducing their expenditures on groceries, either by reducing the quantity or quality of food they are buying or by substituting less-expensive alternatives. We are now seeing the highest level of food bank usage in Canada on record, and the Prime Minister must answer for this. I would like to read a portion of the Food Banks Canada policy recommendations from its website. It states the following: Unfortunately, the story of 2023 is one of government inaction across the country. Our warning has largely gone unheeded—and the repercussions are clear, with nearly 2 million food bank visits in one month alone. The state of poverty and food insecurity in Canada has reached alarming heights. Despite the poverty rates being relatively low in historical terms, we are seeing signs that people in Canada are struggling profoundly. Food insecurity rates have skyrocketed, with nearly one in five Canadians finding it difficult to bring food to the table each day. The current financial challenges have resulted in growing mental health problems and stress related to finances. There is a palpable anxiety, with many people across the country growing increasingly concerned about how to meet their fundamental financial responsibilities, like paying their rent, filling up their car to get to work, and paying for necessary prescriptions. The lack of government action has only exacerbated the problems we were seeing a year ago, and in some cases, for decades prior. What I just read did not come from a partisan Conservative source, as the Liberals would probably like everyone to believe. It came from a reputable and well-established organization with the goal of seeing a Canada where no one goes hungry. What is a simple and straightforward way of doing this? It is to stop taxing the very farmers who produce the food, so the costs do not get passed on to the consumer. If we tax the farmer who grows the food and the trucker who ships the food, it is ultimately the consumer who pays that tax. The Liberals either do not understand this or do not care, and hard-working, average Canadians are paying the price for their apathy. Since the inception of the Liberal carbon tax, my office has been inundated with emails and letters from constituents who call on the government to axe the tax so they can make ends meet. People are so upset and frustrated that they are actually sending me copies of their power bills, something that has never happened before in my eight years as an MP. They want me to see just how much the Prime Minister is hurting them, especially those who live on a fixed income, such as seniors. I am going to share a few quotes from these letters, with the hope they resonate with members across the floor the same way they did with me. One email that was sent to the Liberal House leader and copied to my office says, “You can't be serious with your comment that the carbon tax is minimal in your interview with CTV. The prices of everything we are paying for have been affected! We, as Canadians, are suffering directly from the carbon tax! I'm asking you to please stop with the carbon tax if you really care about the citizens of Canada.” Another email, one that was accompanied by a copy of a power bill, reads: “I'd like to bring to the attention of the Prime Minister what it is like to live in rural Canada. We are so tired of hearing how easy it should be to use public transportation and not rely on natural gas. All those things that are available to large city dwellers. We do live in a town of 1500 people. My husband needed cancer surgery in July and we had to drive 3 hours one way to the hospital. In rural areas, there is no public transportation like taxis or buses that would take us to these appointments, let alone directly from our home to the hospital door. “Our vehicle gas bill is quite hefty.... Gas in our area runs around $1.40 per litre. We drive an SUV, but it still costs $500.00 approximately for the three trips needed every two weeks for my husband's medical condition.” I do not know how much clearer we can possibly be that the carbon tax is hurting Canadians and disproportionately hurting those who are already struggling to afford the necessities of life. To add insult to injury, the Prime Minister has chosen to provide an unfair carbon tax carve-out to those living on the east coast, while those living in the prairie provinces are given no relief whatsoever. According to the Liberal Minister for Rural Economic Development, if the Prairies want to be adequately represented in the House of Commons, they should have elected more Liberals. Apparently, the people of southeast Saskatchewan are not important enough in the Liberals' electoral math to get the same deal as those in Atlantic Canada. Furthermore, this came from the minister who is meant to represent all rural Canadians, not just those who vote Liberal. This kind of divisive statement continues to cement the fact that the government cares only about those who might be valuable to them when the next election rolls around. The Prime Minister has created two classes of Canadians: those who pay the carbon tax and those who do not. Canadians deserve a government that does the work for the people who do the work in this country, and that includes our farmers, their families and all those who pay taxes and contribute to our economy. Canadians do not want gimmicks or temporary measures. With that said, it is time for a change. It is time to stop taking money out of Canadians' pockets in the midst of an unprecedented cost of living crisis. It is time for a new Conservative government to bring it home for all Canadians.

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Mr. Kevin Lamoureux (Parliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons, Lib.)

Dec/7/23 3:59:45 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, we know that the leader of the official opposition, the leader of the Conservative Party, lives in a government-provided house. He is also provided a government-expensed vehicle. I believe that the leader does not actually pay the “carbon tax”, as the Conservatives like to refer to it; yet, from what I understand, he does get a rebate. I am wondering if the member sees some irony there. Does he believe that his designate should be cashing in on the rebate, while at the same time not having to pay a carbon tax because both his home and his vehicle are provided through the government?

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Mr. Robert Kitchen

Dec/7/23 4:00:41 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I find it quite interesting that the member takes this avenue when he truly understands that everybody, every Canadian who buys any food, pays the carbon tax. On top of that, every Canadian pays GST on that carbon tax, which amounts to millions and millions of dollars that the federal government collects; it says it is giving it back to everybody, but it does not. It takes that money, puts it somewhere and hands it out to whomever it chooses, and it appears to choose only people who vote Liberal.

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Gst

Mr. Yves Perron (Berthier—Maskinongé, BQ)

Dec/7/23 4:01:29 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, the basic problem we face, a problem that has been going on for months, is that some political parties are unreasonable and put different misleading labels on all the others. Here is a prime example of this situation. Today's opposition day was triggered by Bill C‑234, which is currently in the Senate, and by the amendment that was passed in the Senate. Last week, we voted against a motion because some senators had been bullied, which is unacceptable in a G7 country. As a matter of principle, the Bloc Québécois opposed a motion, even though it was in favour of Bill C‑234. I rarely hear the Conservatives talk about that. All that I hear them say is that the Bloc-Liberal coalition is imposing a carbon tax. I wish we could be a little more conscientious and stick to the facts. I would like to ask my colleague the following. Does he acknowledge that some politicians here are trying to act reasonably for the common good and make compromises? That is what the Bloc Québécois did with Bill C‑234, which does not apply to Quebec. I would remind everyone that this bill does not apply to Quebec.

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Mr. Robert Kitchen

Dec/7/23 4:02:47 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I appreciate the member's very reasonable question. While I might respond that, a lot of times, I see the Bloc making issues that deal strictly with Quebec as opposed to all of Canada, his comment about Bill C-234 is very appropriate. I recognize that Bloc members voted for the bill when it was here in the House, where the people we represent are the common people of this country. Everybody voted for that. We supported it, and it was passed unanimously here in the House of Commons. It was then sent to the Senate, where it is being stalled and delayed. Therefore, I appreciate the member's comment and the support that the Bloc gave to Bill C-234. I look forward to the changes being made to Bill C-234 such that it is passed and helps our farmers.

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Ms. Bonita Zarrillo (Port Moody—Coquitlam, NDP)

Dec/7/23 4:03:44 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, the member knows that my grandpa's farm was in Asquith, Saskatchewan, and I spent much of my childhood out on that cattle farm, jumping on hay and picking eggs up from the chickens. However, I want to talk about corporate greed in the grocery stores. I worked in the grocery industry for over 20 years; every time a new product comes into a large corporation, the corporation wants hundreds of thousands of dollars from the supplier to get what is called a “listing” in the grocery stores. If it is tofu, cheese or any kind of product that a supplier wants to bring into a grocery store, that supplier is paying hundreds of thousands of dollars to do that. Where does the member think that money is being recovered from?

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Mr. Robert Kitchen

Dec/7/23 4:04:32 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, showers sometimes do not hang high enough. I have talked with the member in the past about her being from a farm in Saskatchewan, and it is great to see that. Ultimately, the government said that it called in the producers and the business to come, and look what has happened—

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The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Alexandra Mendès)

Dec/7/23 4:05:06 p.m.
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I am sorry, but we are way over time. Resuming debate, the hon. member for Medicine Hat—Cardston—Warner.

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Mr. Glen Motz (Medicine Hat—Cardston—Warner, CPC)

Dec/7/23 4:05:13 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I have it on good authority that the Prime Minister's favourite Christmas movie is The Grinch. In fact, it may be where the Prime Minister came up with the idea for his carbon tax. Just like the Grinch took the food off the plates of the Whos in Whoville, the Prime Minister is also a fan of taking food off the plates of Canadians. The Grinch took more of a hands-on approach to ruining Christmas by personally going into their homes and stealing the food. That may have seemed too much like real work for our ivory-tower Prime Minister. He simply used the CRA to collect his carbon tax, but the effect is still the same. He has removed the presents out from under the Christmas trees of Canadians and left the pantries of Canadian families empty. Here is a twist: Even the Grinch came to realize that what he had done was wrong and he remedied his ways. That is what we are doing here today. We are giving the Prime Minister and the NDP-Liberal coalition the opportunity to prove to Canadians before Christmas that their hearts are not two sizes too small and to remedy their ways. We all know that the next election will be a carbon tax election. Even this grinch of a Prime Minister knows that most Canadians will no longer vote for him and are rejecting the inflationary carbon tax, which really does nothing for the environment. Maybe, just maybe, the Prime Minister, in the Christmas spirit and all, will allow Canadian farmers, first nations and families to afford to eat and heat their homes this Christmas and will provide some relief from his Christmas-killing tax. Maybe he does not understand. We know that he refuses to listen to common sense, but maybe one of his ministers will be able to relay a message. Here is the message, so they should get their pens ready: A tax on farmers is a tax on food, period. It is pretty simple. However, it is worse than that. It is a tax on healthy, locally grown food. Annoyingly, it costs the consumer more to buy food, but that generally seems to sum up the Liberal approach. The carbon tax on healthy food is where this tax becomes even more nonsensical, but that is also not unlike the Liberals. Take, for example, the produce grown at Big Marble Farms, a large greenhouse operation just outside the city of Medicine Hat. Do members know that carbon dioxide is used to feed greenhouse horticultural crops? Big Marble, and all greenhouses, use CO2 generated from heating and operating their facilities to feed their crops. Just think about how nonsensical the carbon tax really is when considering that. The Liberals tax the very CO2 that enriches greenhouse crops to utilize their full photosynthetic potential. This environmentally friendly process of using the CO2 generated from greenhouse operations using natural gas helps grow plants. However, the Liberals claim that for environmental reasons, they need to tax the carbon that produces fresh vegetables. Just to illustrate this further, Big Marble Farms will pay over $500,000 in carbon tax this year alone. It will pay $500,000 for feeding the crops and produce that it grows in its greenhouses. Agricultural producers across my riding will each spend tens of thousands of dollars annually on the carbon tax. In order to remain in the business of supplying Canadians with fresh produce, grains, meat and other food, in most cases these costs are passed on to the consumer. It is a tax that disproportionately affects those in my riding trying to grow food and those wanting to eat healthy and local food. Let us take that same greenhouse-grown produce and compare it to the food we see in our grocery stores from other countries, which is not subject to a ridiculous tax. They grow it, ship it thousands of kilometres to Canada and sell it in our groceries stores cheaper than we do. Why? It is because they are not subject to the carbon tax on production or transportation. It makes absolutely no sense, none whatsoever. In fact, “Canadians are reducing their expenditures on groceries, either by reducing the quantity or quality of food they are buying or by substituting less expensive alternatives.” What does this lead to? For starters, projections for 2024 show a 2.5% to 4.5% increase in food prices. Notably, meat is projected to rise another 5% to 7%, vegetables will be up another 5% to 7% and bakery items will be up another 5% to 7%. Why are food prices rising? Rising production costs are contributing to these price increases, all because of the carbon tax. It hurts Canadian farmers, it hurts Canadian families and it hurts our first nations. In fact, a new food price report shows that a family of four will now pay $700 more on their groceries in the coming year. That is on top of the price increases we have already experienced in 2023 and 2022 Do members want to know why we should care at all about this? Let us start with the fact that we are experiencing the highest level of food bank use in Canadian history. In Medicine Hat, the Root Cellar Food and Wellness Hub is our food bank. It is currently feeding 4% of Medicine Hat and the area, which has a population of well over 75,000 constituents. It is a heartwarming level of generosity by the Root Cellar team and the community that contributes, but it is an agonizing statistic when we let it sink in. The decisions that were made in this chamber by the NDP-Liberal coalition government have led to hungry families in my riding and across this great country. I hope that if there are any members in this House, or in the Senate for that matter, who lack the self-awareness required to vote against farmers, first nations and families, they are reminded of this by their own families, by their own neighbours and by their own constituents while they celebrate this Christmas. Food Banks Canada's 2023 hunger count revealed there were nearly two million visits to food banks in a single month, a 78.5% increase over March 2019. It is unbelievable. With that many community members relying on food banks to eat, the NDP-Liberal members must know that some of these visits were made by their own constituents and by their own neighbours. They are going to have to face these people. I do not know how they are going to do that and justify their decisions in those moments they meet them. I am thankful that the Conservative leader put forward a motion to help them. I have the ability to speak to that motion today, thankfully, and will vote in favour of helping those in my community and across this country. How could the Liberal-NDP coalition government and the Prime Minister ever vote against the farmers, first nations and families growing our food, heating their homes and eating? To try to understand how they could even consider voting this way, I may have to look back to Dr. Seuss's book about the Grinch for the answer: No one quite knows the reason.It could be his head wasn't screwed on just right. It could be, perhaps, that his shoes were too tight. But I think that the most likely reason of allMay have been that his heart was two sizes too small.

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Mr. Kody Blois (Kings—Hants, Lib.)

Dec/7/23 4:14:19 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, the hon. member across the way raised a number of very interesting points of debate. I wish I had more time. He talked about carbon pricing and the fact that some other jurisdictions in the world do not have it. However, there are 77 jurisdictions that do have a form of carbon pricing. I was tempted to ask whether this is about carbon pricing itself or the fact that we have to get more countries on board and have it built into a carbon border adjustment mechanism like we are seeing in Europe. However, he mentioned that carbon pricing is forming higher input costs, and he did not talk about anything else, no other factors. There was nothing about climate change and nothing about supply chains. He never talked about the war in Ukraine. There are a lot of Ukrainians in Red Deer, a large proportion of them. We had a bill before this House that talked about supporting Ukraine through a free trade agreement. There is already a carbon price in Ukraine, as we have a carbon price here in Canada, yet the member voted against a simple, straightforward bill that would have supported economic efficiency in that country and could perhaps help Ukraine win the war and get food prices down. Can the member explain his vote?

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Mr. Glen Motz

Dec/7/23 4:15:31 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, while I am a supporter of Ukraine, I know what it is really asking for is munitions, for things that can help it win the war. I want to focus back on my riding. I want to focus back on Canadians. What is driving their costs up is the high cost of production. The carbon tax is exactly part of that. The reality is that we have greenhouses that produce huge amounts of food and have to pay $500,000 in a carbon tax. The Liberals always talk about getting money back, but this is what the net cost is for the carbon tax. It is impossible for them to not pass that on to the consumer and still remain in business. Maybe what we should do is focus on the carbon tax and what it is doing to Canadians right here in our own country.

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Ms. Monique Pauzé (Repentigny, BQ)

Dec/7/23 4:16:27 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I thank my colleague for his speech. To follow up on what my Liberal colleague was saying, let us talk about climate change. What is going to be really costly to taxpayers? It certainly has to do with agriculture, but not with the carbon tax. What farmers are telling us is that the lack of water is going to be costly. Crops lost to pests are going to be costly. Heat is having a real impact on livestock, productivity and reproduction. There is less snow, which protects the earth. As a result of all of that, yes, it will be more costly. Climate change is here and it will be here for good if we do nothing to control it or reduce our greenhouse gas emissions. What does my colleague think of that analysis?

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