44th Parl. 1st Sess.
September 16, 2024 11:00AM
- Sep/16/24 5:10:32 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, it is always a pleasure to rise on behalf of the people of Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo.
Something that has come up frequently is talking about this court case. What I understand is that it is a lower court decision. What really interests me is that the Liberals talk about the decision and ask why it should have been appealed. I will remind the Liberals here that there was a decision of a year or two ago from a court of appeal that they did not like because it was about oil and gas. That very day, the Prime Minister marched in here and said they would be appealing, because it fit his narrative.
I wonder what the member has to say, when the Liberals seem to talk out of both sides of their mouth about whether things should be appealed or not appealed, like this.
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- Sep/16/24 11:14:26 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I tend to say it is always a pleasure to rise on behalf of the people from Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, but today is no such day. We are not here debating legislation. We are here because an emergency debate was called. I certainly did not envision myself speaking here at a quarter after 11 when I walked in here at 10:45 this morning, but obviously this is a very serious matter.
Before I begin, I want to recognize another sombre issue, and that is the passing of a constituent by the name of Jim Babcock. Jim was the father to one of my elementary and high school friends Jason and to Eric, and was husband to Mona. He passed away over the summer. I still have fond memories of him supervising me on my grade 6 trip to McQueen Lake. I send my deepest condolences to his family. May perpetual light shine upon him.
I want to express my condolences to the family members who lost a loved one after six people were taken. It is obviously very difficult. They were somebody's children. They had brothers and sisters. In this House, I often reflect on people who have passed because I believe that these things should be recognized, as we are doing with this debate, and anytime a life is lost, I think about how I would feel if it was one of my children or one of my siblings. In my wife's family, she has two indigenous siblings, so these types of issues hit home for me more than they did before I met my wife.
I can reflect back on my time as a parole officer. That was my first career, when I was only 22 years old. Interestingly enough, I was speaking with a man who is now the Minister of Agriculture. He was actually the Solicitor General at the time, and he was kind enough to come and say hello. I do not think he remembers that he was my boss when I was only 22, but he is still here gracing us with his presence.
That was probably the first time I ever learned about residential schools. I still remember that the first person to really tell me about them was a person by the name of Russell Casimir, who I just ran into at the signing of a sacred covenant between the Archdiocese of Vancouver, the Diocese of Kamloops and the people of Tk̓emlúps te Secwépemc. I think it is the first covenant of its kind in Canada. It is about moving forward documents and history.
Russell talked to me about residential schools, and that was when I first started to learn about different culture, indigenous culture, particularly about the Secwépemc people, understanding things about sweat lodges and smudging. I realized that when one lives in a small community, like so many small indigenous communities, the loss experienced is so much more profound when there is a loss, particularly a loss that is unexpected. It is obviously that these losses are going to be very difficult.
When we have these emergency debates, we have to ask where our leadership is going to come from. I know where I have seen leadership in indigenous communities. One of the people who taught me a number of lessons was my indigenous law professor Paul Chartrand. He taught me at the University of Saskatchewan. There was a lesson he instilled in me, probably in 2006. I looked him up and he is still practising law by the looks of it. He said that if we want to know if something is working, we should ask the people on the ground.
That is why in my prior critic roles, for instance, I have gone to a number of jails. I do not need to speak to an executive to hear about how things are going. I want to hear from the people who are actually on the ground, the people who are impacted. Often, we will resort to listening to people in ivory towers, like a minister, a deputy minister or high-level bureaucrat, and we forget that the people on the ground are the ones impacted.
A good friend of mine, Renzo Caron, has shown me an example as a lawyer. His mom went to residential school. In fact, I think his sister was the first indigenous surgeon in Canada. People like Kukpi7 Rosanne Casimir show so much leadership to me. The member for Fort McMurray—Cold Lake talked about reconciliACTION; these are people who, in my view, are putting reconciliACTION into effect.
A lot has been talked about when it comes to first nations or indigenous policing today. I have had a lot of experience with that. We have what is called the Tk'emlúps rural detachment, which is on the territory of the Tk'emlúps te Secwépemc. Most of the officers are indigenous. Members may say, “Okay, well, how does that impact you?” Well, I sat down with one of the officers. I had asked him whether could we have a meeting. I wanted to talk with him about leadership within his community and talk about politics. How did these things impact him and how could that officer be influential within his own community? I was also fortunate to have another officer, Corporal Jim Toye, come to my class when I taught sociology to talk about what it was like to be an indigenous police officer.
Most people here know that I was previously a prosecutor. However, two cases that I worked on are, I think, opposite of the debate that we are having. One was a young girl; she was 12 years old, and her mother was murdered when she was 18 months old, I believe. As a result of that, she went to live with her grandmother and her grandmother's husband, not her paternal grandfather, and she was abused.
I will never forget the thank you I got from her after the trial. She testified bravely and told her story. Not only did she tell her story, but she told the truth. I saw the resilience in that young woman, who had the deck stacked against her, to stand up. However, I worry about her; I worry about the psychological life prison that she may be dealing with. That is the reality that so many indigenous people in Canada face. Her mother was murdered, and then she was abused before even becoming a teenager. Obviously this needs to be addressed.
The prosecution for the last homicide I prosecuted was, I believe, funded through a program. I am not sure, but the person was believed to be a missing and murdered indigenous woman. She was taken while she was pregnant, while she was at her most vulnerable. It was an undercover police operation, and I think it is important to recognize her. Her name was Angel Fehr. Her family history was difficult to piece together from what I can gather. I still remember the derogatory terms that were used to describe her years after she had passed away.
Clearly there is work to do. Angel was someone's daughter, like the six people we are discussing today were someone's children. She was someone's mother. Clearly we have so much more that we need to accomplish. However, I am grateful that I was able to do that. We see so many people, so many young people, indigenous young people, who are victims. With my work in Internet luring, I worry about young people. I will wrap up by giving my deepest condolences to the families of the young people.
When I was at the signing of that sacred covenant I described, the theme of the speech I gave that night was about coming full circle, about starting and eventually ending my journey. I pledged to do my best on that journey. I know that I have been able to touch on only a part of my journey here today in this debate, but I reiterate my pledge to do my best.
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- Sep/16/24 11:25:24 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, the reality is that the urgency that brings us to this debate, the reason we are here, is not simply because we should do one study or we should do this. We should be acting with urgency in all facets of this debate, not just with respect to one study.
People have talked about the Truth and Reconciliation Commission recommendations and the recommendations from the National Inquiry into Missing and Murdered Indigenous Women and Girls. Obviously, six people have passed away and we are here to discuss it. However, we are not only here to discuss it; we are here to make it a priority.
To my colleague saying that we need to make this one thing a priority, I would respectfully disagree, because we have to make all aspects of it a priority.
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- Sep/16/24 11:27:22 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague for raising this issue. I have been here for much of the debate, but I have not been here for all of it, so I do not know all of the questions that have been asked.
What I hear in my colleague's question is, essentially, what we should be doing and that the Liberals want to delay things. What we should be doing is listening to the people on the ground. Whether it be people experiencing life in one way or another, clearly there is a problem. We have talked at length tonight about overrepresentation in federal penitentiaries, something that I saw first-hand. We have also talked about the disproportionate number of victims that indigenous groups in Canada make up.
If I had to recommend one thing to do, it would be to humble ourselves and resolve to solve this issue along non-partisan lines. I get that committees sometimes meet behind closed doors in order to prioritize, but sometimes we do have to put the good of the nation ahead of the good of the party.
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- Sep/16/24 11:29:11 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, where I come from, there was, I would say, a turning point when it comes to reconciliation, and that was the finding of the 215, known as Le Estcwicwéy. In other words, “the missing” was the term, and the missing does not just define the 215. What it defines, and how it was used through oral history, is to say there were children who went to residential schools and never came back.
In response to the member's question, I am supporting Tk̓emlúps te Secwépemc and all of the other bands, and there are seven or eight in my riding, to the best of my ability. They might be bands like High Bar that have a very small group of people. I try to make myself as accessible as possible to listen and advocate in any way I can, because that is what I can do as a member of Parliament responsive to their needs, and it is for them to tell me what their needs are.
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- Sep/16/24 11:57:41 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, it is always a pleasure to rise on behalf of the people of Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, although today is not a day which we celebrate, given the sensitive topic that we are dealing with.
I have two questions, and my colleague can answer both, or perhaps just one. He was just speaking about policing and moving away from the paramilitary style of the RCMP and its long history. There are a number of indigenous police officers. Is that something that he believes, that we should be consulting with those officers, or should that review come from outside?
Second, the member spoke in a lot of broad strokes with some specific examples, as did I in my speech. If he could do one thing moving forward tomorrow, what would it be?
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