SoVote

Context: House Hansard - 336 - Sep/16/24

Ms. Lisa Marie Barron (Nanaimo—Ladysmith, NDP)

Sep/16/24 4:24:50 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I will try to be as brief as possible. Something that was shared with me, and I want to ask the member his thoughts on it. We know that at least 1.48 million Canadians here and abroad are being violated by the current law. Justice Akbarali, in her June decision, talked about the estimated 170,000 women born abroad who are within the age range when people often start families being affected by this law. She talked about the impacts of this, with children becoming “stateless”. It leads “to women having to make choices between their financial health and independence...and their physical health”. It separates families and forces “children to stay in places [where they] are unsafe”. Justice Akbarali goes on from there. What are the member's thoughts on these comments?

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Mr. Mark Gerretsen

Sep/16/24 4:25:44 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, my thoughts are that the Conservatives should not have opposed the unanimous consent motion presented moments ago to push this along instead of addressing the concerns of the individuals that this member mentioned and the injustices that have been done. We should get this through as quickly as possible. We used to have this supply and confidence agreement that allowed us to do that kind of stuff with the NDP. We do not have that anymore. Perhaps there would have been an opportunity had we had that. Nonetheless, I really hope that we can get this through quickly so that it can become law and that individuals can benefit from it.

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Hon. Bardish Chagger (Waterloo, Lib.)

Sep/16/24 4:26:26 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, there have been discussions among the parties and, if you seek it, I believe you will find unanimous consent for the following motion. I move: That, notwithstanding any Standing Order or usual practice of the House, during the debate pursuant to Standing Order 52, no quorum calls, dilatory motions or requests for unanimous consent shall be received by the Chair.

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Motions

The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Carol Hughes)

Sep/16/24 4:26:46 p.m.
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All those opposed to the hon. member's moving the motion will please say nay. It is agreed The House has heard the terms of the motion. All those opposed to the motion will please say nay.

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Mr. Francesco Sorbara (Vaughan—Woodbridge, Lib.)

Sep/16/24 4:27:32 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I would like to acknowledge that we are gathered on the traditional unceded territory of the Algonquin Anishinabe nation. I am honoured to be here to discuss some highly necessary amendments to the Citizenship Act. Bill C-71 continues to clean up the messes created during the Harper administration, particularly with respect to immigration and lost Canadians. We need to do the right thing. We need to move this piece of legislation forward. It is the right thing to do. It is great to see it receiving support from the other parties, but unfortunately it is not receiving support from the party that wishes to not work constructively for Canadians. This proposal would not be possible without the groundwork laid by the immigration committee during its study on Senate public bill, Bill S-245. I would like to offer my sincere gratitude and appreciation to the Liberal, NDP and Bloc Québécois members for their efforts to help lost Canadians. Citizenship in Canada is precious. It can be attained by birth, by naturalization or by descent. Citizenship by descent in Canada is what we are here to focus on today. However, no matter how they obtained Canadian citizenship, all Canadians should be treated equally in a country as proud of its diversity as ours is. We need to amend the Citizenship Act to address the fact that specific groups have been excluded from citizenship. We also need to settle the constitutional matters raised by the courts regarding citizenship by descent, in particular for people born abroad to a Canadian parent. The Ontario Superior Court of Justice ruled that the first-generation limit imposed by Mr. Harper was unconstitutional on equality and mobility rights. It was a Conservative piece of legislation that was deemed by the courts to be unconstitutional. As the hon. minister said, to understand the scope of the problem, we need to know the history and evolution of the Citizenship Act and the facts surrounding the group known as the “lost Canadians”. We know that cohort is a limited one. The majority of lost Canadian cases were remedied by the legislative amendments that were implemented in 2009 and 2015, with approximately 20,000 people acquiring citizenship or having their citizenship restored through these amendments. There is a specific cohort that met specific criteria. This cohort of lost Canadians was born abroad between 1977 and 1981, in the second or further generations, and had already turned 28. They lost their citizenship prior to the passing of the 2009 legislation and the repeal of this age requirement. When I was first elected, I had a couple from southern Italy, who now reside here in Canada, come visit my office. This situation applied specifically to them. The mother was a Canadian citizen born in Italy who obtained Canadian citizenship through her father. The wife was born in Italy. The mother could not pass down Canadian citizenship to her daughter because of the legislative changes brought in by the prior Conservative government. Again, we are still cleaning up Conservative messes nine years later. The goal of the Senate public bill, Bill S-245, brought forward by Senator Martin from British Columbia, as well as the amendments adopted by the members of the Standing Committee on Citizenship and Immigration, was to restore the citizenship of these lost Canadians affected by the age 28 rule. When Bill S-245 was studied by the Standing Committee on Citizenship and Immigration as amended, it aimed not only to restore citizenship to this group, but also to allow some people born in the second or further generations to be deemed Canadian citizens by descent. Their citizenship status hinged on the condition that their Canadian parent could demonstrate a substantial connection to Canada. In other words, if that Canadian parent had been in Canada for three years before the child was born, consecutively or otherwise, their citizenship could be passed on to that child, even beyond the first generation abroad. Bill S-245, as amended by committee members, also proposed to ensure that children born abroad and adopted by a Canadian beyond the first generation can also access citizenship. In those cases, there is a different process for adopted children, but the end result remains the same. They are Canadian. The Ontario Superior Court decision that deemed the Harper Conservative first-generation limit on citizenship by descent unconstitutional came down after the committee began its review of Bill S-245. Given that the first-generation limit is a key element of our citizenship by descent framework, Parliament must establish a new framework to manage the issues raised by the court and ensure fairness in the Canadian Citizenship Act, something the opposition party does not really understand. Bill S-245 has now gone through a number of changes and improvements based on feedback from experts and those directly impacted. Therefore, we have adopted some of the committee's suggested changes in Bill C-71 to ensure the needs of Canadians are accurately reflected. Bill C-71, an act to amend the Citizenship Act in 2024, would restore citizenship to the remaining lost Canadians and their descendants, doing the right thing for all Canadians. A Canadian is a Canadian is a Canadian. Similar to the proposals in Bill S-245, Bill C-71 would expand access to citizenship by descent with a more broad approach and a focus on inclusivity. These revisions would address the issues raised by the Ontario Superior Court of Justice regarding the previous Harper Conservatives' legislative amendments, including the first-generation limit. As with previous changes to the Citizenship Act that helped other lost Canadians, this bill will automatically confer citizenship on some individuals born abroad who may not wish to be citizens for a variety of reasons, such as employment opportunities abroad that do not permit dual citizenship. There are also countries where being a citizen of another country can present legal and professional barriers and restrict access to benefits. To remedy this situation, the proposed legislation will provide access to the same simplified renunciation process as the one established in 2009. Specifically, this simplified process will require that individuals not reside in Canada, that their renunciation of Canadian citizenship not render them stateless, and that they apply for renunciation of their citizenship through our departmental process. These changes to the Citizenship Act will ensure that any child born abroad to a Canadian parent before the passage of the bill will be a Canadian citizen from birth. The amendments will also ensure that, in the future, children born abroad to a Canadian parent who was also born abroad will also be granted citizenship at birth if their Canadian parent has a substantial connection to Canada. I invite members to share their thoughts on the proposal before us today. I too hope that, with the support of all parties, this bill will move forward quickly and effectively. We are talking about Bill C-71, but more importantly we are talking about Canadian citizenship, what it means and how to obtain Canadian citizenship. I know, in speaking to the residents of Vaughan—Woodbridge this summer every week and at events, we have our issues and challenges in Canada. We do, but one thing I know is that I live in one of the best cities in Canada, if not the best. I know I live in a beautiful province, Ontario, and I know Canada is the best country in the world. I know it will be. We have a bright future ahead of us with this fact of being able to attain Canadian citizenship. Much like the hon. member for Kingston and the Islands said, my parents were selected to come to Canada as immigrants in the late 1950s and 1960s. They won the lottery. I often joke around that it would be nice to win the lottery, but I won the lottery, because my parents were chosen to come to this beautiful country where I now reside with my brothers and my family all over Canada. It is where my wife and I are raising our three children, two of them who play competitive soccer and whom I spend a lot of time driving around, and a little one in day care. They won the jackpot that their grandparents on both sides got chosen to come to Canada and are now Canadian citizens. That is a place we are here for. That is our country. It is the best country in the world. Anybody who says otherwise is just being condescending and trying to do it for political gain, and it is really such a shame. I look forward to questions and comments. I am really happy to be back here to do the good work that we were elected to do as members of Parliament, all 338 of us. We are here for one thing, to make the best country in the world even better.

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Mr. Ziad Aboultaif (Edmonton Manning, CPC)

Sep/16/24 4:38:00 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, besides ballooning the size of the immigration department with negative results and making a mess out of the department itself, what would the hon. member propose? How much stress would Bill C-71 put on the department in addition to the stress that it has right now?

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Mr. Francesco Sorbara

Sep/16/24 4:38:21 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, it is good to see the member for Edmonton Manning. I know he and his family were newcomers to Canada. He has two wonderful sons who have bright futures in this country. I know they have had a great education, are working and are doing very well. That is what Canada is about, so let us give it a thumbs-up. In terms of the immigration department, we know the hard-working people at IRCC are processing millions of visas, millions of applications, because people want to move to this country. People love this country. They know that this country, despite the challenges that we face globally, is the best country in the world to come to and to establish a family. We have gone through some hard times. We have gone through global inflation. We went through COVID. There are wars that we have not seen for 80 years happening in the world. However, I never bet against Canada. The official opposition may, but I will never do that. Canada is the best country in the world.

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Mr. Luc Thériault (Montcalm, BQ)

Sep/16/24 4:39:18 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I have been listening to my Conservative colleague's questions for a while now. I get the impression that he wants to use all of our time or impose time for debate to discuss all the problems that exist with the management of immigration, when this is really about one case of injustice that is simple to resolve. However, he opposes a motion that would speed things up. He is putting on his dog-and-pony show because, according to him, we absolutely must talk about everything that has been done on immigration. We in the Bloc Québécois have also criticized how the immigration file has been handled. We have asked many questions in question period. Why confuse the debates? Why not focus on the substance of the current bill?

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Mr. Francesco Sorbara

Sep/16/24 4:40:14 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I thank my colleague for his question and for what he said. We are here to do the good work of Canadians, wherever they live in this country. This injustice with lost Canadians was caused by a Conservative government under Mr. Harper. He put in measures that were deemed unconstitutional, whether it was for immigration, for justice measures and so forth. That is what happened. They go to the courts. The Conservatives do not like the courts. They do not like the court system and the judges. I hear some heckling on the other side. Again—

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The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Carol Hughes)

Sep/16/24 4:40:51 p.m.
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If hon. members have questions and comments, they should wait until the appropriate time. If the hon. member could wrap it up, we could get to another question.

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Wait

Mr. Francesco Sorbara

Sep/16/24 4:40:58 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I just want to say to the hon. member from the Bloc Québécois, who represents one of the ridings in Quebec, that we need to fix this injustice for Canadians across this country. What has happened is wrong. We know it. Canadians born abroad to Canadian citizens are Canadians. They should have always been treated as such. There are measures here for substantial tests to make it fair and right.

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Ms. Heather McPherson (Edmonton Strathcona, NDP)

Sep/16/24 4:41:37 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I would like to thank my colleague for his intervention in the House this afternoon. I think we could all agree that this very late in coming. I know that my colleague from Vancouver East has done incredible work on this file to push the government to do this and to call out the government for why this has taken so long. I do have a specific question for the member. The commencement provision of Bill C-71 confers discretion on the Governor in Council, so the cabinet, to determine when the act will come into force. It does not specify the timeline or a deadline for when this needs to happen. I wonder if the member could talk a little about the intention of the government, and whether we can be certain that the government will bring this forward and will bring this into effect upon royal assent.

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Mr. Francesco Sorbara

Sep/16/24 4:42:18 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, we need to bring this piece of legislation forward. We need to get it passed with all-party support. The Conservatives should know this is the right thing to do to correct an injustice. I agree with the hon. member that we need to get royal assent and move this into force as soon as possible to ensure there are no injustices to Canadians, specifically with regards to their citizenship. We are very proud to be Canadian. These folks are Canadian, and they would be just as proud to get that citizenship that we are fortunate and blessed to have today.

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Citizenship

Mr. Ziad Aboultaif (Edmonton Manning, CPC)

Sep/16/24 4:42:57 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I will be sharing my time with the hon. member for Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon. Like many members of this House and millions of other Canadians, I was born in another country. Canada is very much a nation of immigrants, and I am proud to be one of them. I came to this country as a young man, leaving behind a civil war that had been raging for much of my life. I came here seeking peace, stability and opportunity. I will admit I did not know that much about Canada before moving here. It did not seem necessary to learn more about what I already knew, that Canada is a cold country with warm people, a place where newcomers are readily accepted regardless of nation of origin, race, colour or creed. What more did I need to know? I was welcomed here with open arms. It did not take long for me to realize that Canada was a place I would be proud to call home. I found a job, got married, started a family and realized just how much this country means to me. I knew I wanted to be part of it and that my future and my family's future was here. I became a Canadian citizen in 1994. I started a business, got involved in community organizations and, eventually, was asked by the people of Edmonton Manning if I would represent them in this House. It has been an honour and a privilege to serve my country in this way. One of the delights of being a member of Parliament is that I have been able to hear so many stories from my fellow Canadians, especially those, like myself, who came to this country to make it home. I have heard hundreds of times how people came to this country and why they chose Canada. Pledging allegiance to this nation is a serious business. In becoming a Canadian, you are saying that you want to be part of the greatest family in the world. Like marriage, becoming a citizen is a serious commitment. It is not something that should be entered into lightly for convenience sake. As Canadians, we are all very aware of our rights. We even have a Charter of Rights and Freedoms. What we do not talk often about is our responsibilities as citizens. It is not only about what Canada can do for us, it is also about what we will do for Canada. Being a Canadian should mean something more than having a passport accepted everywhere in the world. Being a Canadian is a state of mind, of a joining together of different people for a common cause. Because I know what it means to be a Canadian, I cannot support Bill C-71, an act to amend the Citizenship Act, 2024. To me, this legislation devalues the idea of citizenship. It is as if the Liberals want to grant citizenship to tourists. I can see the advertising slogan now, “Come spend your summers in Canada, and after 10 years we will throw in citizenship as an added bonus.” Why are those who wish to become Canadian citizens no longer expected to live here and become part of our country and society? Where is the commitment on their part to become part of the community? Does being Canadian not matter anymore? In 2006, the Canadian government spent $94 million evacuating 15,000 Canadians from a conflict in Lebanon, my home country. Many of those were people who had the benefit of Canadian citizenship with minimal connection to Canada. Once things died down, they went right back to the country that they thought of as their first home. They were “Canadians of convenience”. That is why the Harper government amended the Citizenship Act to restrict the transmission of Canadian citizenship to only one generation born outside of Canada. It does not seem right to me or to most Canadians that citizenship should be granted to generations of people with no ties to Canada. Perhaps it is time to tighten our citizenship rules, not weaken them. We do not need more Canadians of convenience, people who hold Canadian citizenship but live abroad and do not participate in Canadian society. The legislation is intended to address concerns raised by the Ontario Superior Court, which ruled that the first-generation cut-off rule in the Citizenship Act was unconstitutional. However, Bill C-71 is a hastily written, ill-conceived proposal that needs a lot of work to make it acceptable to Canadians. Instead of fixing the problem, the bill would weaken the rules. Under this act, the bill introduces a substantial connection test; for parents to pass on citizenship to children born abroad, the parents must demonstrate that they were physically present in Canada for 1,095 cumulative days at any point in their lives. This rule applies to those who are Canadian-born, those who are naturalized Canadians and those who were born abroad. I do not know what members think of as “substantial”, but being present in Canada for a thousand or so cumulative days does not seem to me to be much of a connection. If people live elsewhere but spend summer vacations in Canada, it would not take that long to reach the required number of days. I can see that this could be a part of a new tourist industry. Maybe I am biased, but I think that experiencing a couple of Edmonton winters should be a requirement for anyone wishing to become a Canadian citizen. After all, one of the things that bind us together as Canadians is the shared experience of cold weather. Certainly, without amendment, the bill would increase the stress on the civil service. Somehow, someone will be tasked with checking that the citizenship applicant has really spent 1,095 cumulative days in Canada. What burden of proof would be required? When I became a Canadian, I did so knowing that I would give my all to this country. I understood that Canadian citizenship was a privilege, not a right, and that it was something offered to those who understood what it meant to be Canadian, who accepted Canadian values and who wanted to work together with other Canadians to make our society even greater. Canada is not my backup plan; it is my only plan. I know how important Canadian citizenship is. However, I do not see that importance reflected in Bill C-71. Both the Liberal Party and the NDP want to play a game. All of a sudden, after they made such a mess of the immigration rules and laws in Canada, they are starting another chapter to make a bigger mess, adding more stress to a failing department and a failing immigration system. Bill C-71 would not respond to that; it would add to the disaster. I will not vote for it.

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Mr. Francesco Sorbara (Vaughan—Woodbridge, Lib.)

Sep/16/24 4:52:20 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, we know that Bill C-71 is the right thing to do. The bill would correct an injustice that was caused by the prior Harper government, when the courts ruled that the law in place at the time was unconstitutional. The Ontario Superior Court of Justice ruled it unconstitutional. This is the right thing to do to correct an injustice. It is about fairness. I have much respect for the hon. member for Edmonton Manning. Why would he not support a piece of legislation that would correct an injustice?

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Mr. Ziad Aboultaif

Sep/16/24 4:53:08 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I already listed many points as to why I do not support Bill C-71. I am not interested in a political game with the Liberals and the NDP. There are many other Canadians the government needs to speak to. The government should hit the road, talk to people and knock on doors. The first thing that will come out is how disastrous the immigration system has become in Canada and why Canadians need it fixed, rather than having an additional disaster added to it.

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Support
71

Ms. Monique Pauzé (Repentigny, BQ)

Sep/16/24 4:53:50 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I want to come back to the last comment that my Conservative colleague made about how Canada's immigration system is a mess and how it is failing in so many ways. I completely agree with him on that. However, Bill C-71 does not deal with the entire immigration system. That is not what we have here. The bill seeks to correct an injustice, which affects women and people who work abroad for the government in particular. That is what Bill C‑71 seeks to correct. The Conservatives are filibustering. They did the same thing with the Senate bill on this topic. They are filibustering to prevent Bill C‑71 from being passed immediately. Is the fact that the bill targets legislation that was passed under Stephen Harper's Conservative government the real reason the Conservatives are against it?

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Mr. Ziad Aboultaif

Sep/16/24 4:54:43 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I am also surprised by the Bloc Québécois. I am not sure what there is for them in Bill C-71. As I said, the bill is ill-conceived and badly written. There is no evidence to support their argument. Therefore, I am surprised. I will throw the question back to them: Why will they be supporting the bill?

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Ms. Heather McPherson (Edmonton Strathcona, NDP)

Sep/16/24 4:55:10 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I have to say that my colleague's speech was deeply disappointing. I was in his riding quite a lot this summer. I spoke to a number of his constituents, a number of people who put him in his position. They are absolutely appalled by his failure to speak up for Lebanese Canadians and Palestinian Canadians about the genocide that is happening in Gaza. More importantly, when he stands in this place and talks about Canadians of convenience, does he feel that he is the one who gets to choose who is a Canadian and who is not?

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Speech
Speak

Mr. Ziad Aboultaif

Sep/16/24 4:55:44 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, for one thing, I deal with my community and I have the backing of my community. I do not need the NDP to go and knock on my doors to tell me what to do. Their time would be better spent elsewhere. The other thing is that I am not the one who is trying to impose anything on Canadians. If anybody is doing that, it is the Liberal and NDP members; throughout the last two years, they have made a disaster of immigration law in Canada. They should be ashamed. They should know what to ask people before they even make such suggestions.

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